On Tuesday and Wednesday the Scottish parliament is debating the bill to bring about a second Scottish indepedence referendum. The first day of debates was mature and thoughtful, allowing the advocates of Scotland remaining a part of the UK to introduce the truly vital and important arguments for their case. Arguments like those of Labour MSP Monica Lennon, who used the debate as an opportunity to highlight the truly crucial issues of the day, the fact that she thinks Stu Campbell of Wings Over Scotland is a bit smelly, and how it’s outrageous that she’s blocked on Twitter by the SNP MSP Christina Mckelvie.
The real issue of course, is the future of Scotland. Although to be fair the hugely important issue of Monica Lennon’s social media experience is considerably more pressing and vital than her party’s notion of a federal UK, because Monica’s blocking by Christina on Twitter is something that does actually exist in the real world. That however didn’t prevent many of her colleagues using the debate as an opportunity to waffle on about their federalism fantasy. There’s no desire for federalism in England, and if we’ve learned anything about the structure of the UK over the past few years it’s the lesson that politically speaking, England gets what England wants, and so do the other constituent parts of the UK.
But Labour just kept banging on about how they want federalism. I want to win the Euromillions lottery jackpot, and there is actually a quantifiable probabilty of my doing so. It’s a tiny probability, a probability that’s quite a lot smaller than the probability of being struck by lightning, but it does exist and it’s not zero. The probability of federalism ever being introduced in the UK is as close to zero as makes no difference.
But it’s worse than that. It’s not just that there’s no desire for it in England, and so zero chance of it ever coming about, it’s also that it’s incompatible with the one doctrine of the British constitution that the Unionists fetishise above all others – the absolute sovereignty of the Westminster parliament. You can’t have federalism under a system in which the Westminster parliament reserves to itself the right to abolish or change it whenever it suits Westminster. It’s not just that Labour has no answer to this problem, they don’t even seem to demonstrate any awareness that the problem exists.
Anyway, the federalism fairy was fulminating in Labour’s full-on fairytale fantasy on Tuesday. The only proper response to it likewise begins with an f, and is immediately followed by the word off. But fair’s fair, at least Labour was trying to put forward some sort of plan for the future of Scotland, however delusional and unrealistic it may be. On the Tory benches there was nothing but anger and contempt for the idea that Scotland should have any sort of say in its future at all. From neither Labour nor the Tories came any admission that there has been any sort of change in circumstances at all since 2014, and likewise they continued to trot out the same arguments that they’d come out with three years ago.
The Tories are apoplectic. Their version of Scottish Unionism means that Scotland should have no say whatsoever on Brexit, and they are outraged at any suggestion that Scotland should have a say. Scottish Tories want their country to be the only country in Europe which doesn’t have any input into Scotland’s relation with Europe. They want their pals in the UK government to have a free hand, they acknowledge that the governments of the 27 remaining EU members will likewise have their say. But the only people who don’t get to voice an opinion on where Scotland is headed as a country are the people of Scotland themselves. Scotland is the only country in Europe whose views on membership of the EU are irrelevant. As irrelevant as the Scottish Tories will be in the vote in Holyrood on Wednesday – because they’re going to lose it. Their anger and resentment was not unrelated to the fact that they know there is a majority in Holyrood for another referendum, and there’s nothing they can do to prevent the bill being passed.
Adam It’s The Law Tomkins decided to go on about Canada for some reason best known to himself. He also consistently referred to Scottish independence as secession throughout his spittle flecked frothing. Calling Scottish independence secession is a bit like referring to fleeing a dystopian nightmare with a crashing economy where you get told what’s going to happen to you for a better life in a different country where you get consulted on important decisions as “a trip to the airport”. There could be a queue! And you’ll be at the back of it.
The Tories have no vision for Scotland. All they offer is obedience to decisions that are made on Scotland’s behalf by a political class that has trouble locating us at the small end of the BBC weather map. The offer austerity. They offer xenophobia. They offer isolationism in Empire 2.0. They kept saying that Scotland doesn’t want another referendum, but what they really mean is that Unionists don’t want another referendum. What they really mean is that the Unionists refuse to acknowledge their failure to honour the promises and commitments they made to Scotland during the first referendum campaign. What they really mean is that they won’t admit that the real reason we’re having this debate now is because of them.
Mostly however, they kept banging on about division. Having spent the first referendum demonising independence supporters, and painting them as a cross between the Ku Klux Klan and a Twitter troll, now they say that it’s too divisive to have a second vote. But that’s what democracy is. Democracy is about differences of opinion, and debating them. Scotland is already divided, and we won’t resolve those divisions by brushing them under a Brexit carpet and pretending that they don’t exist. But that’s exactly what the Tories and Labour want. The question of Scotland’s relationship to the rest of the UK and the rest of Europe remains an open question, and it’s only by allowing the people to engage with that question and address it that we’ll ever have any chance as a nation of moving on from it. That’s democracy.
The Tories think that the way to cure a difference of opinion is by telling those who disagree with them to shut up. The Tories don’t want democracy, they want silence and obedience. They’re not going to get it. Scotland will have its say. Scotland will find its voice. And it’s a voice that’s going to say Yes to independence. That’s what the Tories are really terrified of.
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Wee Ginger Dug 
Well said, Dug. As usual, you have cut right to the heart of it. Looking forward tae seein ye the morn’s nicht in Lockerbie, along wi thon Paul fella that hings aboot wi ye.
What I found strange was the way seveal unionists went on about how it was ‘too early’ and ‘We don’t know what will happen in Brexit’ when it was quite obvious that the vote will be after you do know…
We managed a Brexit vote without having any idea what would happen in Brexit.
what we do know, Andy, is that the EU members are repeatedly saying that there is no way Teresa May and the UK Government will ever get a BETTER DEAL in any negotiations than it already had as a EU Member. So things can only get WORSE !!
[…] Wee Ginger Dug How to terrify a Tory […]
They don’t listen Andy.
Excellent, Paul.
I gather that Tomkins is appearing on another piece of BBC Propaganda Porn tonight.
As many readers are aware this bigoted man stood in our constituency, and we sent him packing. Yet here he is all over the place, the darling’ of the Yoon MSM, telling me what I can and can’t have.
I threw down a challenge to Labour MSPs earlier in the day. Oppose the Tory cuts and obscene human rights violations.
So far, nothing. They are traitors to the Working Class, hell bent on destroying Scotland.
I gather that we are to be treated to the Heavy Mob joining the debate tomorrow, in the considrrable forms of Iain Gray and Jackie Blancmange.
They really are the enemies of the Scottish people.
I reiterate: will just one of them defy the Labour whip, and vote with the Government and the Greens?
Thought not. They are insulting the Scottish people.
They are not ‘Labour’; they are not Socialists.
They disgust me, and doubtless millions of other Scots.
Couldn’t have said that better, Jack. I had been a Labour voter all my life until 2003, when I wasn’t sure about Labour policies, but voted because I have always believed that voting is an obligation to those who died to allow me the right to suffrage. By the next election I did not vote in the general election, and because the policies gelled with me, voted SNP for the Holyrood elections. By the 2014 referendum, I was sure about voting Yes, largely because I thought, and still do, that the people of Scotland should make decisions about what affects us, especially our future. I was also shocked by the antics of the unionist parties, particularly Labour, in Project Fear. What SLabour has done over the last two years is join with the Tories in political point scoring, with absolutely nothing to back up their demands. I cannot understand SLab’s stand on federalism. It makes no sense. And how are they going to cope with the growing Labour for Indy? Whatever SLab is now, it isn’t a socialist party. And how they can accept the attitude of the Tories in the policies they have put forward and to the Scottish Government, in fact, all the devolved governments, completely defeats me.
Labour (especially SLab) have disgusted many people. I have loads of friends who have deserted them and now hold them in the utmost contempt. My own view is that they are beneath contempt.
In the debate of the last few days, there have been no reasoned arguments from the Unionist side at all, just shouting and verbal attacks. The utterly childish Rennie, Dugdale etc couldn’t even stick to the content of the debate, but just launched into a tirade of abuse and pathetic attempts at point scoring with bare-faced misrepresentation of facts and deflection. Davidson even attempted to try to soft talk Patrick Harvie with Wee compliments to attempt to dissuade him. Patrick is too intelligent for her smarmy attempts. They do not defend their own position, but simply set their own agenda, which often has nothing to do with the debate. The paucity of their arguments is unbelievable and rely simply on hubris.
Contrast this with the SNP and Greens, who stick to the relevant topic and formulate clear arguments.
Today’s debate (and I advise considering that description in the widest possible terms), had one particular effect on me personally. It managed to burn forevermore any willingness to listen to an establishment politician’s POV completely from my mind.
The sheer lack of respect, chronic dishonesty and naked enmity on display from the establishment parties made it pretty plain, beyond all reasonable doubt, that they would deny the Scottish electorate the right to choose. Not a single redeeming quality on display from the lot of them and certainly not the courage of their own convictions or confidence in the Scottish electorate to back their cereal based ideology. These ‘public servants’ would deny the Scottish population the vote that is theirs by right and for no better reason than naked self interest. That is a black shame on any Scottish politician and one they can carry themselves. NO ONE else need apply.
As I’ve just posted elsewhere for casual readers.
In any upcoming referendum, vote yes or no as you like (though make it YES or I’ll fecking haunt you), but ALWAYS remember who believed in your right to choose and who had the courage to give you that choice to make.
I simply had in mind just how many of them are List MSPs who were not in any sense “elected” to the Scottish Parliament.
I object to paying for failures and rejects, especially those who take their rewards from the public purse yet would deny the public the right to choose their destination at this time of huge upheaval.
PR is what it is betty (even with the D’Hondt system tacked on). It’s better than FPTP to be sure and until someone puts an improved and more easily understood system in place, it’s what we’ve got.
How and ever I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment about denying the public their rights. Whoever gets into parliament, whether first choice or list, from whatever party, I bloody well expect them to believe at the very least, in the Scottish electorate’s right to choose.
If they can’t do that, then they have absolutely no business attending that chamber, taking public monies and claiming to represent the Scottish voting public. They simply don’t. They’re only representing their own interest.
I have a strong belief that the constituency and list vote should be separated, held at different times. I actually do not object to some minority representation, but, I think the current system does not serve us well.
We seem to have a wee problem in that 3 parties sitting in that chamber would rather help the UK parties govern in the interests of the wealthy rather than the majority and global power mongering.
You are right. Completely unprincipled and duplicitous, reneging on principles and statements that they campaigned on.
Ah, Prof Tomkins, You do not seem to know the difference between a province and a country in union. The speech was a display of self-conceit and imperialistic arrogance. You really are in the wrong country.
I didn’t watch it as my doctor says I must not indulge in activity likely to raise my blood pressure to a dangerous level. We’ve heard their arrogant and anti-democratic voices screaming at us for far too long. As you say, they are terrified that this time we’re going to free ourselves from their London masters and expose their self-serving duplicity.
I too keep hoping at least one of the SLABers will break ranks and do the right thing but it doesn’t seem likely. You’d think at 14% in the latest General Election opinion poll the penny would drop that they have been completely shafted by their Better Together pals. An extinction event surely beckons for SLAB.
Aye, and it’s not as if any of them are wanted down south. Nae gravy train.
Paul, I’ll leave it to you to analyse the Propaganda Porn that was Reporting Scotland’s ‘debate’ chaired , if chair is the right word for SNP heckler, Glenn Campbell.
The ‘balanced’ audience had obviously been chosen by Roden McTernan and MacDougall, and the production Yoon team at PQ.
A middle class teen lad and lassie, another young shirt sleeved lad in his late twenties, early thirties, a middle aged businessman, a red faced rotund Britain voted to Leave, arms folded defiantly Yoon, a tanned elderly lecturer who revealed that we should wait 20 or 30 years, but preferably never, to challenge Brexit, who revealed that he and thirty colleagues were working in Italy, had had their wages cut by 50% and were being denied recourse to the European Courts to fight this, a young woman who exports food and drink but blamed Fiona Hyslop’s business rates increase for endangering her trade with the EU, and a clap on cue routine by the carefully choreographed Yoon Leavers every time Adam Tomkins uttered his Imperialist Brit nonsense. Pro EU/Independence? two women clearly not accustomed to speaking in public, one of whom is married to a Frenchman and is facing deportation, another who asked Tomkins how he faces his constituents (he has none, I voted against him; he is not my MSP, he’s a LisTory bolt on. Nobody voted for him). And a lass from the EU, working at one of our Universities who fears deportation. No that was it. The Pro EU , possibly pro Self Determination ‘balance’ in Campbell’s Yoon Kingdom.
They don’t even try to be impartial these days.
Campbell’s hectoring of Hyslop was truly embarrassing. WE know that you are a bitter Yoon, but ‘chairing’ a debate? Not.
Campbell of course laughingly described this as a balanced audience, and ‘randomly’ picked members of the audience to ask questions. What a coincidence that they were all Brit Unionist Brexiteers.
It has started. Jackie Bird introduced this sham, and Toodle Oo The Noo, told us after the farce, that Theresa May would say No.
Adam Tomkins is a blustering buffoon btw.
Propaganda thy name is Pacific Quay.
PS: I’ll lay money that the majority of Campbell’s ‘balanced’ audience live in Hyndland, Kelvinside, Jordanhill, or Broomhill.
Would it be of benefit to the people if limitation of areas and matters on which List MPs can vote, could be introduced?
It just never ceases to amaze me how any Scot fails to realise that Nicola is absolutely the only party leader who has not changed her opinion, or done an about turn, since June last. I just wish the Tories would change the record from ‘the large majority of Scotland doesn’t want another referendum’. Where on earth do they get that idea from?
But, Annie, Tomkins is a democrat. If the majority vote to kill the first born male child, and Tomkins opposed it, he’d still be there with the Death Squads, because the majority voted for it.
A buffoon of a man with no morals or principles. This man teaches Law, FFS.
Oh, of course. I stand corrected LOL!
bettyboopw, I agree with you. In fact the situation bothers me greatly! Perhaps, before any member gets up to speak in our Parliament they ought to declare their position – ie whether or not they happen to be a “List” MSP. The public should not be left in any doubt. Let’s find a fairer system.
Sorry, should have been bettyboopwp………missed out the final letter.
BTW, can anyone tell me. If TM is stupid enough to refuse to sanction Section 30, can Scotland take it to the European Court of Justice?
Seems the Labour Welsh first minister is now calling for a referendum if Scotland gets one, although they seem to be thinking of some kind of federalism (oh dear!) or a confusing multi-choice vote. Some Scottish input might help as their thinking is a few years behind ours :
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/politics/carwyn-jones-warns-wales-see-12767913
(See comments section)
http://yes.cymru/2017/03/20/welsh-referendum-appeal-carwyn-jones/
Plaid raised the idea of a referendum a couple of days after Ms Sturgeon announced that she was intending to seek agreement for a second referendum. They were followed about 2hours later by Sinn Fein. Does it not dawn on the unionists that the “precious, precious union” is no longer a union, as 3/4 nations are seriously pissed off?
Well said indeed, Paul and Macart.
OT but just got sent this info.
Pro-EU rally Sat 25th March 1pm Edinburgh. Waterloo Place to Holyrood Speakers include Tommy Shepherd,Joanna Cherry, Ross Greer
http://archive.is/70NgQ
Excellent post, and great comments, so will pop over to twitter, oh no, a yoon blocked me other day, end of the world is nigh!
Just one thing, though the list MSP’s are legit of course, re the system. It still stinks, that the unionist ones, being paid a very nice wage, are happy to vote for cuts to the miniscule funds, paid to our most vulnerable, if they are lucky that is. These yoons, are happy to have foodbanks. Happy for the poor to struggle to keep warm, have the basics of what is needed in life, and these yoons even vote for the poor to be made even poorer by the WM government.
That, is why, when they attempt to deny Scotland’s democracy, I can understand people questioning just what they are doing for that very generous wage from the public purse. We need opposition parties of course, but these unionists act only as opposition to the party democratically elected, the SNP. They work with the tories, by not, in any way shape or form, opposing them. Gits.
Spot on about division being in the nature of democracy. “Members of both Houses register their vote for or against issues by physically going into two different areas either side of their debating chambers. This is known as ‘dividing the House’, while the areas concerned are ‘division lobbies’. Therefore, a vote is called a ‘division’.” How divisive is that?
There are times when you can’t not mention Hitler. The is one of them. Can you imagine how far he’d have got telling Stalin to stop resisting his invasion as now was not the time for a war on two, or more, fronts.
My feeling is that it’s the Conservatives who are the ones who play games. They think they know the rules and object when their opponents don’t. “It’s just not cricket!” Is a phrase that springs to mind.
The Tories next move can only be to “remove” Holyrood under some pretext or other!
Send in the army, or take direct rule or whatever. After all, all aspects of a devolved Holyrood they opposed. Slab just sitter on about SNPbaaaaad and the f-word in their fantasy federal UK in lalaland.
The LibDems still think they are just about right on everything as they inhabit outer lalaland2.
When yoons shout and spit venom, then they are worried.
They do not see the irony in that the people of Scotland voted to remain in the EU. But they always roll over when Westminster dictates. Their sole raison d’être is the yoonion. Nothing else. They are like the East European Communist regimes prior to the fall of the Wall and Glasnost and perestroika, took orders from another polity.
Brexit, whatever deal is made,will be hard. Out of the single market and out of the customs union is a hard Brexit! The yoons will just cave in, Tory yoons yes, but the rest?
Sadly, they are all “my Tory Westminster right or wrong, we will obey”.
Mike Russell’s contribution was excellent. He told it as it is.
Ruth Davidson, and her ill advised Press Conference with Fluffy M illustrated this, seems to believe that she has the power to veto the Scottish Parliament on anything.
WM Tories Rule Ya Bass.
Our Holyrood Government can be crushed underfoot by the SE Establishment, and their Filthy Rich Backers.
The Herald Britland headlines with yet another filthy rich businessman asserting that he will not be investing in Scotland because of the uncertainty of the prospect of a Referendum on Scottish Self Government.
It has begun.
The Toronto Affect was referred to by desperate Yoons during yesterday’s SNP Hatefest.
Quebec never recovered you know, when businesses effed off to Toronto in the run Up to Quebec 2.
Be afraid, Ruth’s entrepreneurs, millionaires, writers of wizard stories will take all their money out of Scotland. Ruth will arrange with her Filthy Rich pals to crush Scotland underfoot.
It borders on insanity.
Well, we the people say, fuck off to England rich businessmen.
Little isolated Empire 2 will welcome you with open arms. There will be plenty of spaces on flights to the South, returning to Heathrow empty following a packed northbound leg full of entrepreneurs, car manufacturers, and ordinary folk fleeing Imperial England, and back into the European Union in Scotland.
Many will heed NS’s ‘come and join us’ invite I anticipate mass migration to Scotland in the EU will start on the 29th March 2017.
Neil Findlay(‘I want a country divided by class, not nations’) repeated verbatim Ruth Davidson’s list of ‘not doing the day job’ nonsense, Highlands and Islands Enterprise Council, OBF Repeal, and so on, in response to which Russell commented that the arch Militant Findlay, friend of Gorgeous George, Slimmer of the Year Obesity Czar, (aye, right) and Class Struggle Champion was now siding with Ruth Davidson, the arch right wing destroyer of Scotland’s civic society.
Findlay on his feet:- ‘I voted Remain!’ he yelled.
‘So did Ruth Davidson.’ was Russell’s coruscating retort.
Labour, Lib Dem, and the Tories, Better Together once more.
Labour in Scotland died yesterday.
Yet we are still to hear from Iain Gray and Jackie Baillie.
Jack C. To quote an old line that comes to mind :
“Money deosn’t talk … it swears!”
Marco, ‘but it don’t sing and it don’t dance.~ We do.
… and “sod your revolution if I can’t dance it!”
(Now who said that, or something very similar?)
Take away his/her money and let them live like the rest of US poor
I didn’t watch the so called live debate on BBC as I knew it would be mince. I think a lot of Indy supporters dont even bother to apply to go on these shows as they are so blatantly anti Indy and shear Unionist propaganda.I did manage to watch about 2 minutes of the Scottish Parliament debate on the news before Davidson and co really began to annoy me.Tankette is quoted on BBC news app as complaining in that debate about being sick of SNP games.Well Ruthie do you know what I am sick of that’s you and your cronies lecturing me and the rest of the people of Scotland that we have no right to choose.We did chose SNP by a huge majority in uk and scottish elections and we did not choose Tory or Labour or the other lot that’s democracy so deal with it. I have to ask what are the Unionists scared of (that they might lose) well some here might know that old line from Star Trek “resistance is futile” and Unionist resistance against 2nd Indy certainly ref will be.
Eilidh, we must never forget that Ruth Davidson and the LisTory Boys will not rest until they have destroyed and extirpated any form of social democracy and a fair civic society from Scotland.
They would mirror the horror unfolding in England right now.
The English NHS no longer exists. The ‘national’ health provision has been broken up into separate Trusts, Publicly Funded Health provision is to be cut, sorry ‘efficiencies’ of £22 billion are being achieved by ‘savings’ to the service provided, and ‘private health providers’ have been ushered in by Ruth Davidson and Murdo Fraser to destroy the notion of a publicly funded health service completely.
First they destroy public institutions Down There, in Empire 2, next Up Here by scrapping Barnett.
Ruth is introducing more Grammar Schools, and Free Schools, and diverting chunks of the English Education budget from ‘ordinary schools’, to the politically engineered elite schools.
They have slashed Education funding to the bone, and private providers will be brought in to sort out the Tory inspired mess.
Yet another bulwark of a civic society sold off to the carpertbaggers.
Ruth Davidson has cut LA grants Down There by 40% and services suffer. Care for the elderly, libraries, public baths, playing fields and any vestige of public ownership will be attacked and destroyed. It’s the Tory Way. The 51st State.
If you can’t pay for it, you won’t get it. Try a charity instead.
I personalise all this as: ‘Ruth is.’, quite deliberately.The Tories Up Here are not some separate entity.
Jackson Carlaw will destroy Scottish Society and replace it with a wealthy, privileged elite, and a population reduced to Victorian penury.
He would close Holyrood tomorrow, and not even blink. They are the enemies of the Common Citizen.
Let’s not harbour any doubt.
Labour know that they haven’t a hell’s chance of governing the UK or Scotland for decades to come.
Hence the protracted death rattle of the party during yesterday’s ‘Debate,’
Their collective goal is to squeeze as much money out of being a MSP as possible before we ultimately kick the remaining dregs out on their plump ears.
Tories are stealing bread from Scottish kids to give to the JK Rowlings and the Lord Darlings of this land in the form of tax cuts. Fact.
Rant over.
Horribly, horribly true, Jack.
I totally agree that the Tories here and south of the border have ideological change at heart. They care for no one but themselves. However I absolutely beleive that Scotland will never vote in a Tory government in the Scottish parliament and all of us who believe this country should create its own destiny need to support the SNP government to get the 2nd Indy Ref and to win it.Indeoendene is the only way we will beat the Tories and their foul ideology. Convincing others of this is difficult but in time I think we can change many minds
Nicely put!
The Yes side need to start painting a picture of what will happen to Scotland if we vote NO. A sort of Project Fear, only using the truth instead of lies. The truth of Brexit and Scotland still tied to ruk, is terrifying.
Talk coming from Tory MP’s about refusing to pay the £50 billion Brexit bill and Theresa May’s,”No deal is better than a bad deal”, then just crashing out of the EU, will mean Armageddon for Scotland. The UK will be a pariah state, dragged through the Hague courts. Most other countries will be reluctant to deal with the UK as it would upset the EU. Even if these countries did deals with the UK they would be dealing with a desperate country. They would have us over a barrel.
There doesn’t seem any end to the terrifying facts, once one starts thinking about the repercussions of Brexit.
Of course we have to emphasise the positives about Independence in the Eu which are reason enough to vote Yes. However, the fear of Brexit will guarantee a Yes vote. A sort of double lock.
I totally agree with your first paragraph! Well done.
Can we please scrap the May cooncil elections and General Elections as well – just too bloody divisive, so they are!
Quattro formaggi or Ham and Pineapple.
The battles I’ve fought over that argument.
Grim! 👿
Whether to stay in and watch Saturday night TV with my Everlovin’ or go down the pub with the Rat Pack. Decisions, Sam, decisions.
Simon Cowell of Arthur Guinness?
Ohhhhhh, brutal. The humanity!
‘R’ rated division right there.
“Scotland is the only country in Europe whose views on membership of the EU are irrelevant”.
Er, Wales?
Pan-celtic solidarty is surely important these days, despite the unfortunate Welsh vote!
Threaten the fcukers with tory rule,tell them that if we bottle it again then we will dissolve Holyrood and let the ship sink with all on board,that might just scare them,what a bunch of subservient knee benders,never ever anything positive to offer.
Theresa May at PMQs
“This isn’t a question about whether the people of Scotland should have a choice or not”
That is an outright and bald faced lie by the PM. This is ALL about our right to choose.
Another beaut worth noting however was: “at heart we are one people”. Which I’m sure folks who are of 1st or 2nd generation continental European origin, or folks who have partners of continental orgin, all of whom have the very real fear of deportation hanging over them, may take some fucking exception with. These are people, human beings. They are people with residency rights, civil rights whose investment in our society as new Scots, as UK citizens is placed under very real and direct threat by Westminster Conservative government.
So, yes. Yes I’d say they may have something to say about Theresa May’s ‘one people’ bullshit. Also pretty sure that the near 190,000 EU residents in Scotland are fully aware that a major reason for Theresa May’s ‘not a good time’ delaying tactic is to ensure that the voting rights of these Scottish citizens are removed from any future ballot or referendum.
Right now, finding it hard to grasp why people support this abuse? Why people would support what basically amounts to human rights violation. Is it because they think ‘it’ll never happen to me’? Do they think ‘well it’s that foreign bloke lives down the road, him that’s a neurosurgeon at the Royal’ or ‘it’s that wummin’s Tally husband. Works in that regen company’, or ‘them Polish tattie pickers. They just nick oor joabs, so fuck them’, is that it? Seriously? Can we fit in a few other stereotypes, d’you think?
People you better wise up and wise up really, REALLY, quickly. NO ONE is above having their human rights violated or removed… and I do mean NO ONE.
Unless you’ve been living in a fucking cave for the past seven years LOOK at Austerity/Brexit UK. Look at the food banks, the benefit sanction ideology, the rich/poor gap disparity, the mortality rates, the loss of services across the boards. You are having YOUR rights and mandate abused on a daily basis.
Those EU residents. They are fellow citizens. Those new Scots ARE our people and some folk think its OK to abuse those citizens.
I don’t fucking think so.
So get a fucking grip of yourselves and act like the Scots you are meant to be and the Scots you want to be.
Rant done.
Remember the Glasgow Girls? The community rallied round to help stop the refugees being sent back! If the community could do it then for them (and haven’t they turned out brilliantly?), then why can’t we do it for ourselves? Make no bones, if we lose this one we will be sh*t on by 60 million south of the border, and doubly by the Tory government for spoiling their party!
I often wonder how the Stupid pills are added to the drinking water , the 2014 referendum when the , eh its difficult to describe stupidity , possibly fear in a lot of people made them do what they did , anyway if the same people who voted NO for whatever reason in 2014 are contemplating doing the same thing in the next referendum , all i can say is have you been asleep since 2014 haven’t you noticed the goodies that were promised have not been delivered , and going by the record of this Tory government won’t ever be delivered , do you still feel better together ?.
And Glenn Campbell completely ignored the woman in the audience who described her plight. Her husband is French has lived in Scotland for 17 yeats and faces deportation. She stands by him, and will find themselves stateless.
Campbell should have rounded on that bumptious ass Tomkins and demanded answers.
The other week a poor woman was frogmarched to Edinburgh Airport with no notice, put on a plane for Singapore with the clothes on her back, and £12. Her English husband and English born children were powerless to intervene.
This is not my Scotland; and I suspect not the Scotland the vast majority of my fellow Scots citizens want to live in.
Now I am certain that Campbell knows about these enforced deportations, and EU citizens paying £84 to fill in a Request to Remain 84 page document, only to be refused and ordered to leave the UK But he does nothing during this farcical ‘debate’ to address this very poignant and frankly alarming issue.
BBC PQ is completely corrupted now.
Adam Tomkins was given free rein to spout all the usual BT pish, while he, the so called ‘chairman’, Campbell, and most of the Unionist Audience harangued Fiona Hyslop incessantly.
We live in an occupied colony, and nobody is safe from the neo fascists in our midst.
I’ve just had a heads up about the attack in London.
Madness reigns supreme.Later.
What you describe would be luxury, pure luxury. Macart, I’m afraid it’s gonna be a Hell of a lot worse than the paradise you paint.
The EU, quite rightly, are going to make sure no one is even going to dream, about leaving the European Union again.
Then they came for me – and there was no-one left to speak for me…
OH Panic a incident in the general vicinity of the English Parliament magically stops any further business at Holyrood eh Aye ok that would make sense , wouldn’t it .its maybe just as well because listening to the whining moaning useless unionists , not trying to make a case for this corpse they call a union, but just talking s****e would give anyone a sore head .
A interesting piece by Caltonjack on wings re Fraser & Carlaw and their total failure in trying to be elected to Holyrood and Carlaws stunning business career , add to that Prof two jobs inability to progress further than Fifth place in his distinguished attempt to be elected to Holyrood , that got me wondering just exactly how many Tories have actually been elected not by the list placement system but by actual votes , votes of real people ? . and we are footing the bill for these tossers to spout total pish on a 20 % support from voters , now aren’t we f/kn generous ? .
For as long as we abide by the Yoon rules – laws as Tomkins would express it – we are on the back foot.The SNP government is constrained in what it can say or do, that doesn’t apply to us.
GERS is a stitch-up, and the man who contrived it for Thatcher ( forgotten the nonentities’ name) still sits in the Hoose o’ Lords.
The D’Hondt voting system is an undemocratic nonsense, gleefully installed by the Unionists to thwart the SNP. Wings over Scotland listed out the election votes recorded of list MPs, Tomkins – 13,500 behind the winning candidate, likewise Murdo Frazer, etc etc.
We are subjected to undoubted BBC unionist bias.
So what can we do? Do we meekly accept the above? Discuss.
Lord Ian Lang was the inventor of GERS.
Does anyone think if England wanted an independence referendum they would seek our permission
well said thats where the problem lies , a union where one side and one side only has to ask . permission to do anything now thats a good idea .
*THIS*