Believe in Scotland, believe in yourself

It’s a significant week for the independence movement, although you wouldn’t know that judging by our overwhelmingly anti-independence media. In Scotland the job of most of the media is not to inform, but to keep us uninformed. Because if we were properly informed that 45% support that remains for the UK would probably be dropping even more rapidly than it is.

So with the predictable exception of The National there was no mention in Scotland’s media that over the weekend Business for Scotland hosted an online conference seeking to kick start the grassroots campaign. In this time of lockdowns and restrictions on social gatherings, it’s more important than ever that we have a visible and coordinated campaign – a grassroots campaign which is owned and controlled by local activists on the ground. This conference was a vital and important step towards restarting the campaign. Compare and contrast with what happened when Neil Oliver’s new best friends These Islands held a conference that wasn’t even in Scotland.

Meanwhile the Scottish Parliament is poised to reject the Conservative government’s UK internal market bill. The bill represents the most serious direct assault on the devolution settlement that we have ever seen. The Tories have no mandate at all for it in Scotland. “Hey Scotland we’re going to screw over the devolution settlement” did not figure anywhere in the manifesto of the Scottish Conservatives during the last Westminster General Election. And even if it had done the Tories lost over half their seats in that ballot, and were resoundingly rejected by the electorate in Scotland.

Undaunted, what they’re now doing runs directly counter to the promises that they and the other Better Together parties made in 2014 that the powers of Holyrood would never be altered without the express consent of the Scottish Parliament. They’re doing so without the permission or consent of Holyrood, and without having sought a mandate from the people of Scotland and are ramming through unilateral changes which will fundamentally undermine the devolution settlement that Scotland voted for – explicitly or implicitly – in not one but two referendums and are using their MPs elected from outwith Scotland in order to do so. This is a Tory bill which will break international law as well as trashing the devolution settlement. Even the Tories’ own senior legal representative in Scotland, the Advocate General Lord Keen resigned rather than have to defend this bill. How’s that respect agenda working out for everyone?

Today the Scottish Government published its memorandum on the UK Government bill, and recommends that the Scottish Parliament rejects it when it comes before Holyrood in October. This means that barring something entirely unforeseen, Holyrood will certainly vote against the UK government bill. The SNP and the Greens will vote it down, and they may yet be joined by some Labour and Lib Dem MSPs – or those MSPs may choose to abstain. Only the Tories can be counted on to vote against the recommendation of the Scottish Government, and Tory votes alone are not anywhere near enough.

Because it directly affects the powers of Holyrood, the UK Government’s internal market bill needs to be passed by the Scottish Parliament too. If we had a British Government which respected the promise and constitutional convention that Westminster does not legislate in devolved areas without Holyrood’s consent, the bill would fail if it were not passed by Holyrood. But these are not normal times, and we have a British Government which is prepared to break both international law and domestic law and to trash the conventions of the British Parliament.

Make no mistake, this is a defining moment for this so-called Union that the Tories and their allies keep telling Scotland that it’s a much loved and respected partner in. The British Government will directly overrule the will of the Scottish Parliament and will unilaterally and without Scotland’s consent impose changes to the devolution settlement on Scotland. What this means is that devolution will have failed Scotland when put to its first real test, and will be seen to have failed.

Those of us who are a bit longer in the tooth remember the long and bitter years of Thatcher and Major’s rule, and how devolution was seen as a bulwark which would act to protect Scotland from the malignities of Tory governments that Scotland didn’t vote for. Devolution was seen as means by which Scotland could reject damaging Conservative policies and follow an agenda of its own while remaining a part of the UK. We now see that devolution cannot protect Scotland when Westminster is occupied by a Westminster Government for whom principles means nothing more than the name of a high street clothing shop which closed down along with any pretence that the Conservatives cared about the wishes of the majority of Scottish opinion. Devolution can only work when the British Government respects it. This British Government respects nothing but the pursuit of wealth by a tiny minority and the careers of its senior members.

The Conservatives and their Better Together allies can no longer tell Scotland that this country is an equal partner in a family of nations. That claim is about as believable as Donald Trump’s assertions that he’s paid his fair share of taxes. It now ought to be obvious to everyone in Scotland that when what Scotland wants runs counter to what a British Government elected on English votes wants, Scotland will get what England votes for. Although it’s more accurate to say that Scotland will get what a minority of voters in England vote for due to the ridiculously unfair first past the post voting system that Westminster shows no sign of wanting to change. Scotland is getting what England’s Brexit minority wants. Devolution can’t protect us from it. It has failed to do what it was intended to do.

The dawning of a new future was represented by the Believe in Scotland conference. Despite lockdown, despite coronavirus, we are starting to grasp towards ways that the independence movement can successfully and safely campaign. Faced as we are with an overwhelmingly negative media environment, it is vital that we spread the message ourselves. Too many independence supporters sit passively on social media, bewailing Scotland’s lot. The cure for that is to do something. You can start by registering your support for Believe in Scotland. Find out more on their website here

There will be a referendum on Scottish independence, no matter what Johnson or Gove might say. It’s up to us. It’s up to us to believe in Scotland, to believe in ourselves. We’re the people who will make it happen. You only become powerless when you consent to it, and we do not consent.

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154 comments on “Believe in Scotland, believe in yourself

  1. Dr Jim says:

    “Scotland will have an Independence referendum and Boris Johnson nor anyone else will have a say in it”, Kirsten Oswald SNP MP

    “The people of Scotland will have a choice on their own future in a referendum and it will be put beyond any legal challenge” Nicola Sturgeon MSP and FM of Scotland

    “If the people of Scotland decide they want a referendum then that’s what they shall have” Michael Russell MSP and constitutional affairs minister

    I believe these people

    • Bill Purves says:

      The Scottish claim of Rights, that the Scottish people are Sovereign, not the Queen and certainly not the Westminster Parliament, has been agreed by the said Parliament.
      Johnston has never said no, because the Scottish people, their Scottish Parliament have never asked yet. There is no way he can refuse. Westminster’s claim that the UK Parliament is sovereign is not true, it is the English Parliament that is Sovereign.

    • Wee Chid says:

      Genuine question – Why? There seems to be no evidence that there is any action behind what appears to be rhetoric. It reminds me of
      “The people of Scotland will not be dragged out of the EU against their will”.
      Sorry but I’m just not seeing any practical steps being taken. by those who have the power, towards us actually getting independence and I don’t do blind faith.

      • Alex Clark says:

        There is plenty of evidence, have you heard of the Referendum Scotland Act? What about Nicola Sturgeons announcement to put a draft bill before Holyrood before the end of this parliament term that will state the question to be used and the date and terms for another referendum.

        If you don’t believe that there will be a referendum, then why do you carry on posting on an Independence site and depressing everybody else. You have given up already, stick your head back under the covers and leave the rest of us who do believe to get on with it.

  2. gavinochiltree says:

    Scotland’s colonial print and broadcast media ignore a conference held in Scotland.


    Because they are a colonial media, and only “British” news is news.

  3. Anne Martin says:

    “Only the Tories can be counted on to vote against the recommendation of the Scottish Government, and Tory votes alone are not anywhere near enough.”

    Gives the Tories a taste of how SNP feels in Wastemonster.

  4. Republicofscotland says:

    As we all know the Internal Market bill, will roughshod all over devolution, I’ve even read that it will affect the Barnett Formula reducing Holyrood’s spending powers. However, that’s not all, the Westminster government will be able to supercede Holyrood on a whole host of currently devolved matter, and in effect virtually negate Holyrood, turning it into a talking shop.

    We did hear a similar outcry from the SNP government, on Brexit, Ian Blackford stood up regularly in the HoC, and bellowed out Scotland will not stand for it (Being dragged out of the EU), we all know how that turned out.

    However, the Internal Market bill is far more wide ranging and will do tremendous damage to Scotland’s economy. This time I feel Sturgeon’s hand has been forced to go for independence, sooner than later due to the bill, I see no alternative for her and us for that matter, the end game is near.

  5. Bob Lamont says:

    For clarity, registering is here

    Excellent review of the current state of the disunion Paul, had caught snippets of what had been organised my MacIntyre-Kemp et al, but looking forward to further detail of what was discussed.
    It must have been a successful affair since the negative commentary from the usual suspects were on-line from first light this morning.

    Another development over the weekend you doubtless caught was Gary Robertson and Gordon Brewer (being seen/heard) tearing lumps out of DRoss and Duguid-to-be-True…
    At a guess PQ have suspended SG hostilities and reinstated journalism until the uproar dies down. Their overblown promotion of the Moray Motormouth, not least by the blatant promo by Andrew Kerr after the formal part of the FM’s last Covid Update, may have been BBC “Balance” in their own eyes, but cancelled TV licenses don’t appear to bother them much.
    Yet for all the arrogant monopoly Scottish Media has enjoyed and presided over for at least the last decade, if nobody buys your propaganda you are redundant, they’re not, all that’s left is a formal burial, few will mourn it’s passing.

  6. grizebard says:

    What we are shortly going to see, with Holyrood’s expected rejection of the dastardly so-called “Internal Market Bill” and its likely overrule by a UKGov which has no mandate whatever in Scotland, is the legitimacy crisis coming to a head with a mortal blow delivered to devolution, the (former) settled will of the people of Scotland. Killed by a Tory stab in the back, in defiance of all the sweet assurances given in 2014 and the constipated deliberations of the Smith Commission.

    The answer is direct and unavoidable: a new settled will for total independence from London interference and its serial broken promises. As the rest of the world can readily see, we cannot afford to depend on a UK which consistently acts with utmost bad faith.

  7. grizebard says:

    Whoops – have I ended up somehow in the dunny again…?

  8. […] Wee Ginger Dug Believe in Scotland, believe in yourself It’s a significant week for the independence movement, although you wouldn’t know […]

  9. andyfromdunning says:

    You can guess how the media will report the Scottish Parliaments rejection of the Internal Market Bill. Correct, it is the fault of those indy supporting MSP’s.

    When this happens we must all mail and text everyone we know, even those die hard BritNats in our contact lists. This must help our cause.

    I believe that when this does happen all the SNP MP’s should leave Westminster, ideally MP’s in Wales and NI also.

    I worry a little that they will go for a major attack as soon as Brexit settles down, say in 2024!!

    • grizebard says:

      They’re not waiting till 2024, they’re striking now, under cover of Brexit. See the so-called “Internal Market and Clawback of Scotland Bill”. OK, I made up that last part, but that’s what in effect it is. It’s “gamble big” time, but they’re playing with a partial deck, hoping we’ll fold first.

      If we’re smart, we won’t be waiting anything like as long as 2014 either. It’s fast getting to crunch time.

      • grizebard says:

        Whoops, 2024, not 2014. (That old one is long gone. What feels like a lifetime ago.)

      • Welsh Sion says:

        I believe that when this does happen all the SNP MP’s should leave Westminster, ideally MP’s in Wales and NI also.


        You mean Plaid Cymru MPs, obviously, Andy.

        Have a read of what Liz has to say (but don’t be surprised – methinks you won’t be … ):

        • grizebard says:

          Yes, and I see that the ever-hopeful stalwarts of the Electoral Reform Society are once again pinning all their hopes on the Labour Party championing their sterling efforts to drag WM out of the 17th century. Which Labour likely will do, but as before, only until they (eventually…) get back into power again. Then as soon as the next bus comes along…

        • Hamish100 says:

          Because Sinn Féin does not sit at Westminster the chance to defeat the tories was lost with May.
          I understand the reasons SF why they do not.

          I think the SNP should stay and annoy and harangue which does not happen enough in my view

          • A. Bruce says:

            The annoyance that the SNP cause the Tories in Westminster can be compared to a mosquito that has strayed into the chamber. The only difference would come from a swarm of killer bees. They have the means to disrupt proceedings every day but don’t do it; they might as well pack up and get their arses back to Holyrood now.

  10. grizebard says:

    I think that Nicola herself got this right on the button:

    … when an independence referendum comes – as it will – it will no longer be a choice between independence and the status quo, but between independence and a Tory regime which is intent on crippling Holyrood

    Eyes are being opened by the current crisis as never before, and it takes a very special failure of self-confidence to imagine that a manifestly-duplicitous assault on our existing precious quantum of autonomy during a plague year with an election imminent all somehow doesn’t matter.

  11. Ally says:

    Just donated to Believe in Scotland and looking forward to being an active participant on the campaign trail.
    Excellent article as usual

  12. yesindyref2 says:

    WGD, it’s been a great start to this week. Long may it continue!

    Oh wait, I think I mean not very long, as in “it won’t be long now”.

  13. jfngw says:

    We will be told we should put independence off the table during a pandemic, but the Tories ably assisted by Labour and the LibDem’s, have continued what in effect is the nullification of Scotland as a country and demote it to a region of the UK.

    This is not recent, it was evident what their plans were since the day after the referendum when the first priority was EVEL. Then the clear signal from Theresa May that she intended to ‘strengthen the union’, this internal markets bill has been years in the making. I believe it was probably more important to them than Brexit, which they saw it as an opportunity to implement their plans.

    It’s a shame we lost our bottle in 2017 and gave the signal to Westminster that the Scots could just be walked over if they just held their nerve and ignored us.

    • Alex Clark says:

      Not everybody lost their bottle in 2017 and that’s why we are where are now. In a much better position in terms of support than we might even have imagined in 2017. We haven’t missed the boat, we have taken over the bridge.

      • jfngw says:

        I think enough lost their bottle to put the SNP intro retreat, I’ll save the celebrations until after a total victory.

        • Alex Clark says:

          Nobody is celebrating anything, I’m stating a fact, We are in a far better position today of winning our Independence than we were in 2017. Losing in 2017 is now irrelevant and we need look to the future and not the past.

          • jfngw says:

            You are more confident than me, I see there is around 30% that will always vote for the UK, 40% that will always vote for independence and 30% that blow in the wind. Can we keep the majority of those onboard, I hope so.

            • Alex Clark says:

              I wouldn’t disagree with your assessment, one of the best ways to keep them on board is to remind them that we are winning which right now we are.

              Big our lead up, not play it down is how I see it. Let them see they are going to be part of the winning side, it’s the opposition who’s morale we want to deflate not our own. That’s why I will constantly undermine their leadership, Davidson and Johnson, they are useless and I want people to know that. When it comes to “our” leadership and as far as I’m concerned that will be Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP, I want those unsy=ure about Independence to trust “our” leadersg=hip.

              Internal squabbles about this and that are counterproductive to increasing the Independence vote. Why would a supporter of Independence do that? That question is not directed at you by the way but at the many who are constantly stirring the shit in an attempt to cause discord.

              I choose to ignore all that crap and focus on the task at hand, and that’s simply to keep increasing support for Independence. Somebody else’s politics, I can’t be arsed with what they are and I’m not interested either. I’m only interested in Scotland becoming Independent and that all us with the same view sticking together will make Independence much more likely an outcome.

        • Cheer up jfngw it’s a long way to …

  14. Hamish100 says:

    Believe in ourselves. More power to our elbow.Did attend a pre covid meeting business mtg with Gordon Kemp up in Ardrossan And was good. Even one your meetings to and patted the dug. Highlight of the evening!

    Still the undermining is strong elsewhere and should be called out.

    Ian Brotherhood says:
    28 September, 2020 at 1:27 pm
    Serious question –

    Who should be hoofed first, Nicola or her man?

    Does the individual believe Sheridan will take us to the promised land? Campbell? Absolutely no chance.

    The fact is the majority of the voting public support Independence, support the SNP or Greens and supports the First Minister.

    What happens after we regain Independence will be up to the people.

    • Dr Jim says:

      Left wing socialists are always left wing socialists no matter which political party they ride the backs of in between waiting for the great revolution

  15. If you feel so strongly about ‘calling it out’ why not do so directly? Are you barred from WOS?
    In any case, I don’t see my comment as ‘undermining’ anything. It was a serious question and plenty of folk are asking variations of the same.
    As to who should replace Nicola/Peter, I have no idea. That’s SNP party business, for members to decide. However, the broader Yes movement has an obvious interest in that decision and will be watching very carefully.
    I note that you avoid the points raised by Stu in that post. If you’d care to address any of them I’m more than happy to have a discussion, either here or btl at WOS. Your shout.

    • Ian brotherhood, how do you know that the broader Yes movement is interested in replacement of Nicola/Peter ?
      How do you know they are watching carefully ?

      ANSWER……you don’t …neither does WOS
      You are guessing
      You have a gut feeling ?
      You talk to people ? ….how many ? Millions ? Hundreds of thousands ? NAH you don’t neither does WOS

      More and more people are saying they are in favour of Scottish independence that’s FACT not just a gut feeling
      The FACT that more and more people are supporting Scottish independence shows that they are satisfied with the performance of the SNP and that includes Nicola and Peter.

      Not every Scottish independence supporter likes every SNP policy
      That Ian Brotherhood is NORMAL

      People on WOS have said they won’t support independence any longer because of a Scottish government policy they don’t like
      If they are swayed away from Scottish independence by a policy of the Scottish government they were never ever committed to Scottish independence the way I and many others are.

      Your continual backbiting Nicola Sturgeon is futile
      It’s too late to change the leadership of the SNP it’s not going to happen before the next Scottish independence referendum
      The SNP have said the plan detailing the campaign supporting Scottish independence and how and when the Scottish independence referendum will take place will be published by spring 2021 that’s just a few months away perhaps as much as six months

      Get behind the SNP and Nicola Sturgeon she will be leading us forward to independence
      Not the sideline huggers you talk of

      • Wee Chid says:

        Presumably you aren’t a woman with long fought for rights being put directly at risk.

        • Alex Clark says:

          Your cause is not Independence at all, is it? You have your own agenda.

        • What are those long fought for rights being put directly at risk ?
          Provide some proof to back up what you say please because I don’t see any women’s rights being put directly at risk that were not already directly at risk

    • weegingerdug says:

      If you want to discuss Stu Campbell’s talking points, you can do it on his blog.

    • grizebard says:

      Frankly, you might wish, but I don’t see any need to think about replacing anybody right now, when we’re on the very cusp of a significant step forward in the elections next spring, on the back of the most able demonstration of effective autonomy we have ever yet seen. All this miserable bitter nods-and-winks, “angels on pinheads” stuff, is for the birds. The only possible effect it can have is to help the BritNats, who are very obviously aiming for the exact same thing. Funny bedfellows, what?

      The argument used to be about the GRA (which has since been quietly shelved) and having a list alt-indy party to “augment and assist” the SNP, but it already seems to have degenerated into the familiar old leftard backstabbing and backbiting over nothing. Probably because its little band of supporters can already smell the disappointment to come and it rankles. Thankfully though it’s all under the radar for ordinary voters, as well it might.

      That’s not to say the SNP is not under notice, but our judgement on that must properly await the outcome of the elections and how the party handles the aftermath, and not be used in the stupidest way possible to damage our chances beforehand. In which latter case, however unlikely it may be to happen, any reckoning would fall very firmly on your side of the account.

    • Hamish100 says:

      Yes, I am banned. No swear words no abuse Just disagreed with his position. F Off is usual response when he cannot provide a rational response. You answered your own point. It is for the snp to decide their way forward. Rather successful I would say. The public agree.
      They are beginning to believe in themselves. Hopefully you may believe that the only way forward next year is to support the SNP and if you so wish in the 2nd vote, the Greens. Not my choice but the other so called Indy parties will undermine.

    • Petra says:

      Ian you know full well that a number of people who post on here have been barred from Wings, so ”discussion” is out of the question. In fact I took a look at the BTL comments earlier and there was little ”discussion’ going on at all, as per the norm now. There was only one poster on the site who seemed to think that Campbell’s proposals were ludicrous and it won’t be too long before he / she is hounded out too. Every other person on there was ripping Nicola Sturgeon / the SNP apart to varying degrees. Strange don’t you think that around 99% of people agree with each other on Wings when support for the SNP stands at over 50% and Nicola Sturgeon is by far the most popular UK politician among voters in Scotland (YouGov). So what’s going on over there? A bit of an imbalance?

      I’ve also noticed you point out that the Alex Salmond case / Peter Murrell issue doesn’t get covered on here. Maybe that’s because most of us want to hear what the key players have to say before pronouncing them guilty as you (and others) seem to have done. Pretty hypocritical of you all don’t you think, that you wanted everyone to consider Alex to be innocent until such time that he was proven to be guilty (or not), but Nicola Sturgeon and her husband haven’t to be afforded the same opportunity. TBH it’s like a rabid witch-hunt on that site now and how any of you think that you’re converting people to supporting independence is beyond me, Ian. If anything you are damaging the independence movement altogether and seemingly? can’t see it. And yes some of us on here don’t agree with a number of SNP policies but they can be dealt with after we get our independence. Meanwhile we should be standing shoulder to shoulder until such time as we get out of this nightmare of a Union.

      • weegingerdug says:

        I thought I had already explained why I don’t use this blog as a platform to attack the SNP leadership. It’s for the exact same reason that I don’t use it as a platform to attack Stu Campbell, Mike Small, Craig Murray or anyone else in the movement. My job is to make the case for independence, to articulate arguments which have a chance of persuading no voters / undecideds / or unsures to support independence, and to boost the morale of those of us who are already working towards independence. That’s what I will continue to do, and I will not be distracted or sidetracked by anyone else’s agenda, whoever that may be.

        • Alex Clark says:

          Reflects my views exactly. We do all have our differences but have the same ultimate goal. How we get there or who wins the race is unimportant, we need to get there first. We should bury any differences we have until we achieve Independence. It’s pointless arguing about them now while Westminster is still in control.

          The main job of every active Independence supporter is to persuade another one person to support Independence. Nothing else at all, it really is that simple. For now, we have nothing worth arguing over, because as of yet we are not Independent.

    • A. Bruce says:

      I must say Ian, I do agree, Murrell has to be booted out as soon as possible otherwise there are going to be dire consequences.

    • Julia Gibb says:

      I left because discussion was not allowed. I joined a long, long list of those who no longer post on that site.
      I got the message loud and clear…”if you don’t want to destroy the SNP..don’t post on Wings”

  16. Derek Rogers says:

    I don’t think the SNP is committed to independence. In fact, I think they’re actually against independence. It’s very worrying.

    • weegingerdug says:


      You are doing Michael Gove’s job for him. You’ve already given up and the only winners are the Conservatives, and they haven’t had to lift a finger – you’ve done it all for them.

      To say that the SNP is actively working to prevent independence is the worst kind of conspiracy theory nonsense. The problem isn’t the SNP – it’s you.

    • Alex Clark says:

      Hahaha FFS!

    • weegingerdug says:

      This kind of defeatism is the biggest enemy of independence. You are hardly going to be able to persuade anyone to come over to supporting independence with that sort of attitude.

      I assume that you feel the way you do because in your view the SNP leadership is not pursuing a referendum as actively or as quickly as you’d like them to.

      One of the problems we have as a movement is that some people are so fixated on getting another referendum that they forget that getting a referendum is not the point of the exercise – winning independence is the point. It is counterproductive to push for another referendum before Scotland is in a place where it’s going to vote yes and we’ll win that vote. It’s counterproductive to push for a referendum when the Yes movement is unable to make use of its full strengths as a grassroots movement. All that would achieve is the Quebec scenario, where they had two referendums and lost both, putting any chance of independence off the table for decades.

      I don’t want a referendum that we’re not going to win. It’s only within the past couple of months that Scotland has arrived at a point where a majority support independence. Yet at the same time we’re in the middle of a pandemic and the grassroots movement is unable to deploy its traditional campaigning strengths – face to face persuasion, town hall style events, local canvassing, and rallies. These are strengths which we are going to need in order to overcome the messaging from the overwhelmingly anti-independence media in this country.

      Not everyone is as convinced about the need for independence as you or I might be. That’s the sad reality of Scotland. You may not like it, but the problem here is not the caution of a political party which recognises that we’re only going to get one shot at a referendum and we can’t afford to blow it. The real issue here is that unless we ensure we have majority support at every step along the way, in this cautious country which has only recently started to become majority pro-indy, we will lose.

      We will not win independence when we insist that people who support independence but whose tactics and strategy are not producing the result we want RIGHT NOW are really trying to prevent independence.

      Michael Gove is laughing.

      • What Paul says.
        Glenn Campbell nodded sagely on cue as DRoss declared that the SNP handling of the Uni outbreak was a ‘shambles’. And that’s it.

        Prime time BBC North Korea.
        WE go when we’re ready, at a moment’s notice.

        Hang On a Minute Brewer was touting the Fabian notion that the SGE be deferred until October ’21.
        They are running on empty, and they know it.
        I reiterate, the 15th October will burst their dam.
        No Deal begins mid October, not Jan ’21.

        I am as impatient as anyone. But a campaign now is out of the question.
        Grass roots groups reforming now, and Project Retaliate First can begin now.
        See my earlier posts elsewhere.
        There is plenty of work to do now.
        We have ‘hit the ground’, speed walking.

        • Alex Clark says:

          Jack, I would hazard a guess that the can will be kicked down the road for maybe as much as a month after mid October. Westminster do want a deal but won’t get one on their terms but they will keep trying and the EU will accommodate them until the last minute

          • Alex, the ERG group, Rees Mogg, Francois and about 50 fellow Little Englanders are more than happy with No Deal and the immediate chaos that it will precipitate; in the late autumn, not miraculously on Jan 2nd, following the Bank Holiday.
            Everything from inhalers for asthmatics to toilet rolls will run out in weeks. Just in time car parts will stop arriving from Europe to English car plants..drip drip..
            There is no more road down which to kick the battered old Brexit can.

            • Alex Clark says:

              Yep, I’m well aware of that, still think the EU will give them another month to come to their senses though.

      • Derek Rogers says:

        I welcome this response, which is a sensible one – thank you for posting it. Your point about not having a referendum until we can win it is crucial. But I also believe – and it’s not just a feeling of impatience, but a belief based on a reasoned analysis of their behaviour – that the SNP will never deliver a referendum. (I won’t do you the discourtesy of posting my reasons here, I’ll post them on another site, later, and send you a link.) Both of these things are, I believe, true – that we shouldn’t call for a referendum until we’re likely to win it, and that the SNP will not deliver it. Closing down debate on the second of these points is a bad step, because without SNP support we’re going nowhere.

        • Alex Clark says:

          Your still posting, so nobody is “closing down debate”. Do you mean disagreeing with you is closing down debate? If not what did you mean because I don’t see any attempt at “closing down debate”?

          • Derek Rogers says:

            See WGD at 8:18pm and 8:41pm:

            “You are doing Michael Gove’s job for him…You are hardly going to be able to persuade anyone to come over to supporting independence with that sort of attitude…The problem isn’t the SNP – it’s you.”

            That looks to me to be saying that people have a duty not to post these views – a classic way of closing down debate. Fortunately Paul thought again and gave his fuller response, which I think takes us forward.

            • Alex Clark says:

              Well, you read it wrong, he disagreed with you and never said that you weren’t entitled to your point of view. You are just making shit up in order to support your point of view, This is called having a debate and nothing is being shut down as you have claimed.

            • weegingerdug says:

              Derek, if I really was “closing down debate” I’d have banned you. You’re entitled to your opinions. But you’re still wrong.

        • Derek Rogers says:

          I said I would post my reasons on another site, and send you a link (and I welcome not being banned, because I can now do that – so I agree, the debate has not been closed down). Here are my reasons:

          Now please explain to me why you think that the SNP, under its present leadership, will deliver another referendum.

          • Alex Clark says:

            So the debate hasn’t been closed down, how’d have it eh?

            As for another referendum. It’s simple, Nicola Sturgeon says she will deliver one. Now you explain to me why she won’t.

          • weegingerdug says:

            None of the reasons you list constitute proof that the SNP is against independence.

            1 & 2 are about the Conservatives, not the SNP. A refusal by the Conservatives of a Section 30 order is a vital first step in ensuring the legitimacy of successive steps. That can best be achieved by refusing to concede Johnson has any right to refuse.

            3 A mandate for a referendum means bugger all without majority support in Scotland for independence. The point is not to get a referendum, the point is to win it.

            4 There have always been bitter internal battles within the SNP. Even if there was indeed a conspiracy against Salmond, it does not necessarily follow that those involved in it did so because they don’t want independence.

            5 Sometimes in politics it’s better to have ambiguity. The SNP leadership clearly feels that at the moment ambiguity about the legal status of a referendum without a Section 30 is politically more advantageous. I don’t necessarily agree with them, but their stance does not prove that they don’t want independence.

            6 The SNP would still get funding in an independent Scotland. The opposition parties would be in the exact same position and would likewise seek some version of short money in an independent state.

            7 Sheer supposition on your part.

    • jfngw says:

      Why would that be, if you had any real talent and were against independence surely you would join the deadwood that frequents the three London financed parties. It’s much easier to shine when your fellow colleagues are so lacking in stature, the Davidson cult is a prime example.

    • grizebard says:

      Oh, I agree, it’s very, very worrying.

      It’s so very, very worrying for all those panicking BritNats whose lying and dissembling is finally all coming unravelled in front of the eyes of the entire Scottish public by dint of exposure to reality in the form of a genuinely worrying crisis.

      And who are evidently now getting so very worried they feel forced to resort to pathetic concern trolling on WGD. (sigh)

  17. Golfnut says:

    I’ve been posting for quite a while now that Treaty/Contract law trumps domestic law and its nice to have this confirmed by no less than the SP.
    Well worth a read since its Joanna Cherry providing the information.

  18. grizebard says:

    There’s only two things we basically need to get right to win – infectious self-confidence in ourselves as a people, and an ability to provide sufficient reassurance to the waverers.

    The rest is just down to good timing.

    • Alex Clark says:

      110% correct, before we can become Independent we have to BELIEVE we are capable of being an Independent country. That is not a concern of mine but it is true of many others who lack that same confidence as I have.

      That’s why we must always put forward the positive case, not for us already convinced but for those yet to be convinced. You don’t do that by doing as the Britnat media and politicians do constantly in attacking Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP.

      Let’s all do our best to ensure that when the next referendum takes place we win with a massive majority, I’d settle for just a majority but that won’t stop me wanting a massive majority. We do that by doing what we have been doing all along, one person at a time.

      We have them on the run let’s not do ourselves damage by arguing amongst ourselves how dark our toast should be in an Independent Scotland. All of that is irrelevant because first we must gain Independence and we must not lose sight of that. Eyes on the prize.

  19. Ken2 says:

    The Tories will be voted out. Lost any lead. Now trailing. Gone before long. If people want Independence. They just have to vote for it. The mess and shambles the Tories are making is extraordinary.

    They had to get rid of Thatcher for closer ties with Europe to improve the economy,

    The pandemic total mismanagement by Westminster. Exposed day after day. Condemned repeatedly. People totally realise the lies and bluff of the Westminster incompetents. Never have so many been promoted above their capabilities.

    • grizebard says:

      What happens to the government in London is of no concern to me. There’s no possible replacement that will fundamentally treat us any differently, maybe just dress it up a bit prettier for the show. The English are perfectly free to elect whomsoever they please.

      Though I would not like to take the case too far, in many ways the present BoZo Regime is a good thing for independence, since it makes the longstanding abusive relationship within which we currently remain trapped so much more tangible to many.

  20. Welsh Sion says:

    There’s a good repost from Mike Small against these naysayers, over at Bella. Heck, if I a non-Scot, non-voting, non-Scotland living, YES supporter can believe in you who want (and will get) independence – why the blood and stomach pills can’t you believe in yourselves?

    Is it that you are still feart? You still suffer from the cringe and are happy to remain indoctrinated by a compliant media to be considered some part of kailyard kitsch decorating a shortbread tin – with yourselves locked within that tin?

    If you say I have no right to voice my opinion on Scottish independence because of any of the permutations of the negatives I listed above, that’s just fine. But you will then be guilty of attempting to ‘cancel’ both me and thousands of fellow Welshies who actively support our Scottish cousins in their noble aim of freedom from an uncaring, selfish, arrogant and incompetent Westminster cabal.

    “‘It is in truth not for glory, nor riches, nor honours that we are fighting, but for freedom from Westminster control – for that alone, which no honest man or woman gives up but with life itself.”

    That Bella piece:

    • grizebard says:

      Well, I think there is a residual reluctance (shall we say) to shoulder full responsibility for being the sole trustees of our own awesome power. No more shrugging shoulders and having someone else to blame.

      It’s a prospect that’s simultaneously thrilling and scary. Like watching lightning. (Bring it on!)

    • Alex Clark says:

      It would seem that the majority of Scots are no longer “feart” many more to win over yet though and that should always be the goal. I wouldn’t call them “feart” either, just yet to be convinced and to have their eyes opened as to the benefits that Independence will bring.

      Yes, I do wear rose tinted specs because I am fully aware of the possibilities that Independence offers the people of Scotland. Have no fear.

    • Statgeek says:

      Some are so brainwashed, that they trust a BBC accent over a Scots accent, when being told news.


    • Petra says:

      Thanks for that WS. Great ”exposé” from Mike Small on Bella. Well worth a read.

      ..”The reality is that we face the very real prospect of winning a legally binding internationally recognised plebiscite that we are already publicly committed to. What you are being asked to believe (by Mr Campbell) is that this would be a good time to overthrow the party that will win that mandate and negotiate that referendum.”


      Someone else joining in with the SNPBaad cabal. Ooops it’s a Tory this time. DRoss too wants ”to overthrow the party that will win that mandate and negotiate that referendum.”

      ”Douglas Ross’ hypocrisy brutally exposed in excruciating BBC interview.”

      ”It takes a special type of mindset to be the leader of the Scottish Tories. The job, it seems, requires you to have a razor sharp focus on the Scottish Government, while being totally oblivious to what your bosses are doing in Westminster.”

  21. Ken2 says:

    Cutting their nose off to spite their face is not a great impression to give of Independence supporters. More interested in prima donna activities than carrying out their supposed supporting ethics. No one is above the movement of equality. It is too important.

    So many good SNP candidates of excellence. Not a bad position to be in.

    Support for the SNP/Independence increasing. Not decreasing. Supporting Independence when people vote for it.

  22. Statgeek says:

    “Devolution can only work when the British Government respects it.”

    With a government that has consistently shown zero respect for pretty much every aspect of society, political, legal, scientific and professional, I don’t expect anything soon.

    This government has shown (and their members have been polled) that they would ditch Northern Ireland to secure Brexit. Strangely, they won’t ditch the nation that apparently costs them half of the nation’s debt.


  23. Ken2 says:

    Northern Ireland will not be ditched. That is a Tory problem. People will vote for reunification. Demographics indicate that is the case.

    Tory problems on all fronts means they will be defeated. Collapse on all quarters. The Tories are only in it for the money they can try to skive off. Liars always get found out.

  24. Dr Jim says:

    Today I had another email from my MSP assuring me that an Independence referendum is on the way scheduled for next year and if folk remember it was scheduled for this year but Covid gave that a doing for all the obvious reasons even though the tin helmet folk squealed that they’d somehow been let down (pants to that nonsense)

    A couple of weeks ago I had an email from my MP telling me the same thing, at the beginning of this thread I listed a bunch of folk saying the same thing too and yet still there are the psychics and tellers of half truths insisting differently without evidence proof or fact to back up their claims of party intrigue, and the thing is I don’t care who likes who or who’s not kissing who hello anymore and hand holding in corners, that’s not my concern or job in life to care about

    I’m a voter and member who pays for and votes for the only party who can deliver the thing I want, Independence, and they’ve promised to do that, and I believe them because to not believe them is as dumb as a bag of rocks when they know as we know if they don’t try at the very least to deliver what the voters want the voters will lose faith and not vote for them and no political party on the face of the entire earth actually wants people not to vote for them

    So when folk on the internet behave in exactly the same manner as the Daily Express or the Daily mail and even quote those rags in their anti SNP piffle you’ve got to know those people are not working for Scotland they’re not on Scotland’s side, they’re either Unionists or somebody’s paying them to do it, y’see I don’t care if Nicola Sturgeon dresses up as a pantomime horse and gallops round the house on her own time, I don’t care about her coffee machine or her shoes or her hairstyle or whatever colour of outfit she happens to have on, and I don’t care what her opinion on books is (I’m sure she’s very knowledgeable) none of that is what gets me up in the morning because it’s all her own private business, my business is does she do a good job of running things, tick, is she going to do what she says on Independence, that’s a big tick from me and I’m happy

    Once that’s done Scotland gets the chance to start building and the current crop of doomsayers can shrink back to where they came from or help the country that they actually live in, remember a lot of them don’t live here

  25. scrandoonyeah says:

    I stopped reading Wings about 2 years ago and much more relevant today is Ian Lawson’s ‘Yours For Scotland’ blog.

    There is no doubt a lot of people have concerns about the apparent shenanigans within the hierarchy of the SNP.

    I just hope, when or if, the rupture comes it doesn’t harm our cause and that is a real worry.

    • Alex Clark says:

      That lot of people you say “have concerns about the apparent shenanigans within the hierarchy of the SNP” clearly doesn’t include the 55% of people who say they will vote for them in the Holyrood election 2021.

      Nobody really cares, other than those that want to make it look like it has some relevance in order to further undermine the SNP. It doesn’t.

      • scrandoonyeah says:

        If you want to bury your head in the sand that’s up to you.

        Maybe you should send your last paragraph to Joanna Cherry to see if she agrees with you.

        • Alex Clark says:

          You’re the one with their head in the sand, you are refusing to acknowledge that support for Independence is at 55%, you are refusing to accept that support for Independence is increasing day by day.
          You’re also an idiot if you believe Joanna Cherry wants to undermine the SNP.

        • Hamish100 says:

          Conspiracy theorists love making up conspiracies. They don’t do irony.

  26. velofello says:

    Reference Derek Rodgers comment …” the SNP are against independence”. If he had posted instead that the SNP leadership are content with devolution it may have caused some here to pause and consider.

    Ms Spears, so quickly endorsed, surprisingly by the First Minister, is a devolution supporter it seems from her statements.And then I recall Pete Wishart had notions to be the Speaker at Westminster.

    My career experience of our Southern neighbours guides me to say that they will never agree to a S30 bit of paper.The Withdrawal Agreement is another reason/opportunity for the SNP to withdraw from Westminster, declaring “not in our name”. Would be a much more effective move towards independence than the FM daily Covid briefings.

    I was simply stunned when the FM stated that she had set aside politics – to concentrate on Covid. The FM’s role and expertise is politics not medical issues.

    • Alex Clark says:

      You are a self confessed halfwit.

      “I was simply stunned when the FM stated that she had set aside politics – to concentrate on Covid.”

      Your ignorance of Covid-19 is unbelievable and just as numbers of cases are taking off again, for an ex Project Manager who has travelled the world to come out with the crap you just have is astonishing. Go and do some reading, here’s a starter, you might learn something and you seriously need to do some learning.

    • Dr Jim says:

      The daily briefings are the main reason why support for Independence is at the last poll 56% because many thousands of people who only saw the BBC or Sky or STV news or read an opposition newspaper never got the chance to see or hear the FM uninterrupted in her own words and be given the proper opportunity to judge for themselves what kind of person she is, and they’ve judged that she’s the person to do the job and they’re ready to vote for Independence because of it

      The FM has never stopped doing politics she stands there every day in front of the nation and takes responsibility for everything, that’s real politics and you don’t have to sell it because people just want to buy a product that works

      There’s no other politician in these islands who can or could do it better, that’s why they tried to get her off, that’s why Johnson is prepared to pay someone £100.000 to do the job he can’t, that’s why the BBC was forced to reverse their decision to remove her because of the public outcry and the obvious bias they displayed in even trying

      The FM has cornered the market in real politic, no bluff no bluster no spin, just her

    • weegingerdug says:

      Ignoring the biggest global crisis since WW2 is pretty poor politics. Sorry, but to imagine that we can just continue as usual during a pandemic which is killing thousands of people in Scotland is simply delusional.

      As others have pointed out, it’s precisely because of the competent handling of this crisis by the Scottish Govt that support for independence has risen. It’s made people realise that Scotland can not only deal with an international crisis of this magnitude, but that Westminster is holding us back from dealing with it even better.

    • Derek Rogers says:

      It seems to me that the SNP leadership are content with devolution. That’s a problem we’re going to have to deal with.

      • Alex Clark says:

        What a tube you are, seriously is that the best you’ve got LOL Yah divvy.

      • grizebard says:

        The only problem we have is concern trolls like you desperately trying to demotivate.

      • Eilidh says:

        Where is your evidence of that. There isnt any. There is a far bigger chance that the moon is made of cheese than that being the case. Oh look just another escapee from that other blog talking mince as usual

      • Hamish100 says:


        It seems to me….. yeh it probably does if you keep your head at a certain angle.

        That is your problem.

        It seems to me that unionists are unionists

    • Petra says:

      ”I was simply stunned when the FM stated that she had set aside politics – to concentrate on Covid.”

      I would imagine that the vast majority of Scots would be ”stunned’ to hear you say that velfello as saving their and their loved ones lives will no doubt be their number one priority right now and if she had decided to follow your advice Nicola Sturgeon’s credibility as a caring, competent leader would have gone right down the stank, imo. Can you imagine her trying to get (independence) info out there in conjunction with relaying the latest CV19 facts 🙄? Then there’s the wee issue of us getting out onto the streets to campaign, you know to get the numbers up to ensure that we actually achieve independence. Time to get real 😀.


      And take note as we see an upswing in Nicola Sturgeon’s popularity rate and support for her party rises, LBJ’s personal and party rating slump. Something to do with the fact that she decided to put a referendum on hold to focus on dealing with Covid?

      Richard Murphy:- ‘The government’s policy might now be described as econocide: the deliberate destruction of economic well being to the point that it is life-threatening.’

    • grizebard says:

      The current number of people in hospital with CV-19 in Scotland is doubling exponentially every ~12 days at the moment. If this continued unabated (which it won’t, because appropriate measures will be taken as necessary) there would be 1000 people in hospital by the beginning of November, and who knows how many associated deaths. (And you don’t even want to think how many there would be by Christmas.) That’s how serious an exponential increase is. So it’s hardly surprising that in the meantime our FM is mightily preoccupied night and day – as she clearly shows – with having to battle with this damned thing on our behalf.

      I do wonder sometimes just how lacking in gratitude, sensitivity and understanding some self-declared “supporters” of independence can be right now, having their little tantrums online because the grown-ups have more pressing matters to deal with first. But like it or not, this particular crisis won’t just disappear because you have decided it doesn’t suit your notions.

  27. Calum says:

    For all their faults, the SNP is our only hope at the ballot box . Anyone who continually attacks them , instead of the opposition, does not support independence .

  28. Ken2 says:

    Keeping people alive is really important. The major part or responsibility of any administration. State or otherwise. Life expectancy in the south going down. 120,000 premature deaths before the pandemic. Austerity. Now the numbers can be on the rise again. Without immediate action being taken of prevention because of the pandemic.

    Vote Tory to die younger. Not a great campaign realisation. Totally losing any support.

  29. Velofello says:

    Alex Clark: that you have fully misunderstood my text is …well. Half wit.Ex-project manager?Now you demote me, a wee bit higher up the tree plse.

    Never miss an opportunity to keep your mouth shut, and refrain from expressing insulting nonsense, Alex.

    • Alex Clark says:

      See when you finish reading the paper, come back and tell me which part of the conclusions that the 31 scientists involved in writing it made that you disagree with. Then we can have a discussion.

      Higher up the tree, hahaha.

  30. Petra says:

    ‘Lawyers instructed on possible legal challenge to Internal Markets Bill.’

    ”Lawyers last night said they have been instructed to consider pursuing a legal challenge to the British government’s Internal Markets Bill. Ó Muirigh Solicitors in Belfast and Hampshire-based Hackett & Dabbs LLP said they had been approached by “concerned citizens” over concerns the legislation will override parts of the Brexit Withdrawal Agreement.”..


    Phantom Power:- ”Dave Do-Bad caught out again on Douglas Ross’ idea for shared infrastructure spend in Scotland when Internal Market Bill hands those powers to UK Govt ⁦@ScotTories.”

  31. Petra says:

    Phantom Power:-”More @ScotTories hypocrisy. @david_duguid caught out demanding Scottish Govt extend furlough in Scotland when his own UK Govt, which has all the levers, is bringing the scheme to an end.”.


    Check out Ann’s links on the Indyref2 site.

  32. yesindyref2 says:

    I don’t think so really. That there’s a hard-core unionist vote of 30% or anywhere near.

    Last time the question was directly answered in a properly constituted attitudes survey, there were only about 8% wanted Holyrood abolished, that’s 92% support devolution more or less or don’t care.

    And with Devolution under threat, as many of us have said and Sturgeon said today I think, it’s no longer a choice between Independence and the status quo – there IS no status quo. The long anticipated Internal Markets Bill grabs powers – and worse.

    The potential vote for YES is 92%, and maybe even some of that 8% just want rid of too many politicians “with their snouts in the trough”. Well, get rid the Westminster lot, not the Holyrood ones.

    THAT means our constituency is approaching 100%.

    That would do for me – Should Scotland be an Independent Country? 98% YES, 2% NO. I would of course accept 50% + 1..

    • Alex Clark says:

      I admire your confidence and hey why not 🙂 🙂

    • grizebard says:

      Disagreement with abolition of Holyrood isn’t synonymous with support for independence, though. Up until relatively recently the SG has been caught in “mitigation hell”, where too many people were quite comfortable with devolution while expecting the SG to shelter them from any-and-all unhappy consequences emanating from London. (Encouraged by Rickety Limpet & CO, who seem to believe that Brood’s Broon’s federalism is an established fact.)

      It is this reality that the zoomers conflate – it’s not the SNP who are comfy with devo, it’s too many voters who have heretofore been too lazily content with the devo status quo. Well, those voters are now getting a whole series of wakeup calls, not least of which is that there-will-be-no-more-mitigation. The Covid crisis has finally enabled Nicola to “escape with one bound” and deliver a few home truths about the purse strings.

      I prefer then to take account of my fellow natives’ natural caution, and look for perhaps somewhat less than the support given to devo (albeit by a previous generation), but expect a win nonetheless.

      However, once the tipping point is passed, there’s no accounting for how far things might flip. So surprise me! If it’s even over 70%, I’ll stand you a drink. And if it’s over 80%, make that two. (grin)

      • yesindyref2 says:

        Well, analysis and stats can take unusual turns, and for instance, there could be an apparent correlation between oh I don’t know, thne orbit of venus and cabbage crops. So hey, analysts say that when venus is ascending cabbage does well, and when it’s descending it’s a bad year for cabbages. But it turns out both have a correlation between the frequency opf Dr Who episodes on repeat, so the actual conclusion should be that the cast of Dr Who are very very good at cultivaating cabbages. If you see what I mean.

        In this case I’m looking at the submissions to Smith and the Holyrood results before and after. Devolution ref was 25.4% NO, backed only by the Tories who got 15% in 1999. They went up a bit but in 2011 in spite of Godlie’s co-operation in the workings of Holyrood, went down but only slightly compared to Labour who were jujst so neagative it gave people the boak.

        Then in Smith Labour’s offereing was truly pathetic, whereas the Tory one was OK plus they said “This is the floor, not the ceiling”. Voila, their vote soared to 22%. So there you go, it could be said that your vote correlates to your support for devolution/

        Where are the Scottish Conservatives now? Adrift if they glue themselves to the Infernal Market Bill, probably down to 12% and maybe even less.

        So they are leaving their own potential voters stranded, with nowhere to go.

        “Hello, I’m over here, have you ever considered voting YES for Independence? Oh, good, let’s talk”.

  33. Petra says:

    Don’t miss this one. Jon Snow giving it laldie 🤣😂🤣.

  34. Alex Clark says:

    I’ll leave you with this, we are admired around the world and I’m a proud Scot with no buts!

    No crying.

    • andyfromdunning says:

      Where is the auditorium? Do you know?

      • ArtyHetty says:

        Not sure, Austria? The lady bagpipe player in the fabulous blue dress does a solo, ‘Scotland the brave’ (?) and it’s bloody marvellous, you can see much of the audience in tears. Look on youtube.

      • Bob Lamont says:

        Amsterdam in 2013 ?
        The pipe soloist is the redoubtable Manoe Konings

    • ArtyHetty says:

      Watched that recently, wonderful, get the hankies ready!

    • Jim says:

      Also this which is really inspiring.

      Our new National Anthem?

      • Eilidh says:

        Great tune but it was written by two German blokes and allegedly words were written by an English person. So don’t see it becoming our National anthemn

      • Bob Lamont says:

        Perhaps “Hey Tuttie Tatie”, or the later Burns interpretation “Scots wha hae”, or the “Marche des soldats de Robert Bruce” set with wording to a modern Scotland with a nod to the auld Alliance.

        Although the Burns version is better known to Scots (in it’s time bordering on treason), it’s a tune still held in high regard across Europe particularly with the military. If memory serves correctly it was played as a central theme at the French state funeral of the two special forces marines killed earlier in the decade.
        Perhaps this amateur recording of the “Pèlerinage des Troupes de marine à Bazeilles” with 3 young pipers is worth a consideration, god only knows what a massed pipe band would to to the hairs on the back of my neck though.

    • diabloandco says:

      So much for ‘no greetin’!

  35. Golfnut says:

    This is going to be very interesting, along with the Canadian research on
    hydrocarbon extraction from oil makes Scotland’s liquid assets highly desirable.

  36. Petra says:

    ”I just interviewed @ChrisMcEleny and asked him about #PlanB for Independence.#Scotland #indyref2 #SelfDetermination. You can watch the full video on @rosalia_tv on my blog and on my FB ‘O mundo de Pilar-Aymara’ and here.”

  37. Petra says:

    ”BBC Scotland adopted & pushed a pro-return to university line prior to students returning. On Aug 31st Kaye Adams asked callers what they thought. Contributors [chosen by BBC Scotland] were *overwhelmingly* in favour, as was Adams herself. Excerpts below.”


    Phantom Power:- ”DECONSTRUCTING JACK 🇬🇧 A closer look at the Union Jack – as demand for Scottish independence grows, is it time to wave the British flag goodbye? #Scotland 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿.”

    • Golfnut says:

      An excellent wee video, other than repeating the nonsense that Scotland was forced into the union because it was burdened with debt.

  38. ArtyHetty says:

    Great article, some excellent comments, Alex, Dr.Jim, and Petra et al. Thanks for the links, will check them out. Keep countering the doubters and faux independence ‘supporters’, Scotland deserves so much better, and the BritNats’ negativity is so long in the tooth, they have had their day.
    It’s time for positive change. No going back now.

    • Petra says:

      Agreed no going back now ArtyHetty 😎. It’s onwards and upwards from here on in 😀. Look out BritNats here we come 🤬.

  39. Petra says:

    The UK’s future PM is standing down 😀.

    ‘Jo Swinson will not be standing in next year’s Holyrood elections.’

    ”The LibDem leader (wee willie winkie) said Swinson, who lost her Westminster seat to the SNP’s Amy Callaghan in one of the biggest upsets of last year’s General Election, has a new job and has not applied to be a candidate.”


    Check out Ann’s latest links on the Indyref2 site.

    • Bob Lamont says:

      Vowels across the world are heaving a sigh of relief…

    • Welsh Sion says:

      Well, well.

      ‘You’re not my Jo” is in my and Arthur Thomson’s neck of the woods – when she ‘visits’, that is … Maybe we should get advanced warning so as to lay out the red carpet …

      Swinson was recently unveiled as a visiting professor at Cranfield School of Management.

      • Eilidh says:

        She was my MP good riddance to bad rubbish. It was bad enough she regained the seat in 2017 thank goodness she isn’t standing again. She doesn’t live in Scotland any more which was part of the reason she got booted out in December

  40. Republicofscotland says:

    So Willie Rennie has vowed his LibDems (Remove the democrats bit, he, they oppose democracy by refusing our right to hold an indyref) will vehemently oppose a a second indy vote.

    We must assume that the likes of Rennie and other British nationalist MSP’s at Holyrood, know fine well that the Internal Market bill will virtually neutralise our own parliament Holyrood, in favour of a foreign parliament Westminster, and in the process not just remove our chances of becoming an independent nation once again but also lower our living standards as well.

    People like Rennie must be treated with contempt, contempt that he has for his fellow country men and women. Rennie and Co would rather see great harm come to Scotland than allow Scotlnad a way out of this madness.

    • Then he’ll be quitting Holyrood forthwith?
      This pin brained little chancer is a waste of oxygen, and his merry wee band, Rumble Bumble Crumble and Coal Scuttle cost us about a million a year in wages expenses and office space.

      Come the revolution, duggers, we drive these wasters from office once and for all. Where do apply for one of these ‘visiting’ professorships? Wendy Bring It On got a wee sinecure up in Dundee as memory serves. Dugdale and Davidson on nice little Think Tan earners paid for by me and thee.
      Now Swansong gets a wee back hander.

      The whole system is corrupt to the core.

      WE kick them out of office, but still pay for their pie and chips, for ever?

  41. Republicofscotland says:

    The hypocrisy of Westminster really does know no bounds as Westminster’s bars and restaurants are exempt from the 10pm curfew, not only that there is also no requirement to gather contact details from those who enter the bars. Add in that there’s no stringent rules at all around the use of face coverings, which applies to other licenced premises.

    The rule of thumb is do as I say not as I do from Westminster.

    • Let’s hope all the good looking young interns can padlock their zip flies shut then.
      Any news on Ross Thomson’s fall from grace?
      Thot not.

    • Golfnut says:

      I believe they have back peddled on the drink issue, the rule now is that no alcohol will served on the parliament estate after 10pm.

  42. Ken2 says:

    The Westminster drunk dunces. Most of them should be tested for drink and drug consumption. The illegal Barnett Formula extension. Not taxation without representation. The Westminster absolute corruption. Now coming back to haunt.

    The Tories going down in support. They will be voted out. An utter mess and shambles of extraordinary proportion. The Tories/ConDems cut NHS funding in the south £4Billion a year from 2015 to 2020. £20Billion. When it needed more funds.

    A vaccine is needed. Not self harmful, illegal medication.

  43. Dr Jim says:

    There are 25 distilleries in England making English whisky, I learned that from an American on Sky news this morning who informed us that it’s very small at the moment but was sure it would grow

    When Ireland became Independent the English government choked off their ability to sell Irish whiskey to the world in retribution for becoming Independent then they promoted Scotch whisky which they hadn’t previously done because that would’ve meant Scotland might begin to get a sense of its own worth and the English government had never wanted that but then they needed to make up the loss of Irish whiskey revenue which was considerable at that time

    So now the English are making their own whisky to replace Scotch but they’re doing it while still retaining Scotland’s revenue from whisky and we’re letting them do it stupidly like some kind of invasion of the whisky snatchers
    They will steal our green power generation, they will steal our water, in the 60s they stole our educated brains, there’s not a country England have had their greedy mitts into that they haven’t stolen from and there’s not a country that doesn’t celebrate their Independence from them, and there’s not one country who has ever asked to be returned to the British Empire

  44. Alex Clark says:

    Nicola Sturgeon is a genius in how she deals with the idiots in the press at these briefings, yes I’m a fan boy.

  45. Dr Jim says:

    We’re in the same support group Alex

  46. robert alexander harrison says:

    This is why i always say you dont trust those southerners an inch they are always making promises they have no intention of keeping they treat our nation and its people like shit and expect us to just sit down shut up and let them dictate everything hell no a part of me would just wacth England burn itself to the ground as that nation would sacrifice the rest of the planet just to save there own necks look how they mocked the nations of Europe over covid instead of preparing for it now its running rampant yet thousands of English think its nothing but a hoax our southern neighbours are bat shit insane.

  47. Capella says:

    This is a great and positive thread. I love the videos too – thx Alex & Co – lots of good comments.

    Pete Wishart’s explanation of why the SNP is not currently going down the legal route for a S30 decision is sound IMO. It is most likely the courts will decline to rule decisively on a political matter. Andrew Tickell has spelt out that message too. The danger is that if the courts rule “NO” then we are indeed in a worse position. Besides, I am certain that NS and the leadership already know the answer and are keeping their powder dry. It is not clever to fire off all your rockets prematurely.

    To Ian Brotherhood – I would comment directly and engage in debate as you suggest. But I’ve been banned from that site so can’t engage. “No debate” seems to be the mantra in The Other Place. I understand why Paul does not want the bilious rage to spill over onto these pages so have refrained from commenting here.

    If you want to debate then why not ask the site owner to invite people with different opinions to come back and express them?

  48. Hamish100 says:

    Capella…. Wait a mo. I’m Spartacus !

  49. Julia Gibb says:

    I thought I would share this comment line from a BBC HYS

    “Priti Patel wanted to build a gulag for asylum seekers in a barren, volcanic wasteland far from humanity. Someone suggested her soul would be the perfect venue.”

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