Except for voters in Scotland

pointless
Can you hear that sound? It’s the sound of ferrets reversing. It’s the sound that Andrew Bowie makes when he hails the mandate won by Boris Johnson for Brexit while he tries to deny that the SNP won a mandate for another independence referendum in Scotland. It’s the sound made by thousands of anti-independence zoomers on social media as they share graphs of vote share showing that the combined votes won by the Tories, Labour, and the Lib Dems were greater than those won by the SNP and the Greens. It’s the sound made by a certain Labour activist on social media who described Scotland as a sub-set of UK constituencies. It’s the sound of panic. It’s the sound of desperation. It’s the sound of hypocrisy. It’s the sound of authoritarianism and the death of democracy. It’s the sound of a Westminster General Election except for voters in Scotland.

The rules of a Westminster General Election are unfair. The first past the post system so beloved of the Conservative and Labour parties is designed to produce large majorities. That’s the very purpose of the system, and that’s why the two largest UK parties prefer it. It gives them the opportunity to command crushing majorities in the Commons and to govern without having to bother making the sort of coalition deals or political accommodations with other parties which are the norm in countries where there is a more proportional voting system. It’s the first past the post system which has delivered a Commons majority of 80 to Boris Johnson despite the fact that his party won only 43.5% of the popular vote.

Andrew Bowies says that the SNP don’t have a mandate because they said that this election was not a vote for independence. He’s wilfully conflating support for independence with support for an independence referendum. The two things are not the same Andrew. The SNP stood asking for a mandate for another independence referendum not for independence itself. And they won that mandate, no matter how much you try to obfuscate. You don’t get to claim that the SNP doesn’t have a mandate based upon its 45% vote share when you yourself are only able to stand up in the House of Commons and make an arse of yourself as an MP because you won 42.7% of the vote in your own constituency. More people voted against you than voted for you Andrew, so by your own standards you have no mandate, and should resign forthwith. You’d be doing us all a favour, and you’d stop embarrassing yourself. Win win.

At a UK level as well as at the level of constituencies where they won, the UK parties have no problem with the first past the post system. It’s only in Scotland that they seek to apply a different set of rules. Last week’s vote was a Westminster General Election, conducted under the first past the post rules which Westminster has imposed. Supporters of Westminster can’t then turn round and pretend that the vote in Scotland was really a proportional one. It wasn’t. It was a Westminster General Election, and by the very same standards that allow Boris Johnson to claim a mandate for his version of Brexit and to command a majority in the Commons, the SNP won a mandate and a majority in Scotland. Them’s the rules. They’re your rules, British nationalists. You don’t get to suspend them just because your own rules have produced a result that you’re uncomfortable with.

In 2015, the Conservatives under David Cameron campaigned in that year’s General Election asking for a mandate to hold a referendum on EU membership. The Conservatives won that election in the UK, with a majority of 12. There was no question that they didn’t really have a mandate, despite the fact that the Conservatives won that majority with a mere 36.9% of the popular vote. The very same people who are now sharing graphs of vote share on social media to “prove” that the SNP doesn’t have a mandate were quite happy to concede, or indeed to revel in, the fact that the Conservatives had a majority and a mandate for a referendum. Yes, we’re looking at you, Tory boys and girls. You don’t get to apply a different set of rules in Scotland now.

What British nationalists can’t legitimately do is to pretend that the General Election in Scotland was really a referendum and to apply referendum rules to it. Neither can they tot up all the votes for the Labour, Lib Dems, and Conservatives and use them as a proxy for the views of individual voters on whether or not there should be another independence referendum. It’s well known that a significant chunk of Labour’s voters in Scotland not only support another referendum, they’d also vote yes for independence. Some Lib Dem voters might decide in a few weeks time that their own party’s promise that it’s only a Lib Dem vote that can ensure Scotland remains in both the EU and the UK has clearly been overtaken by the circumstances of this Conservative government taking us out of the EU, and they may well feel very differently about another Scottish independence referendum. But then this is Scotland, and normal rules of democracy don’t apply here. UK General elections come with the caveat, except for voters in Scotland.

Meanwhile, arguing that you can’t take a mere subset of UK constituencies and claim that you have a mandate based upon the election result in those constituencies is quite possibly the cringiest description of Scotland since that BBC journalist made his wee “joke” about the new SNP MP who wore a kilt for the official swearing in ceremony in the Commons. We’re not even a region anymore, just a subset.

Scotland is not a mere random subset of UK constituencies. It’s not like you get to cherry pick after the event and choose those constituencies where you got a result that you wanted. Scotland is one of the constituent nations in this so-called union, and moreover it’s a nation where all the UK parties, the Labour party included, presented a distinctively Scottish manifesto to the voters. It’s the height of hypocrisy to claim that it’s legitimate for Labour or the Conservatives to present a Scottish manifesto to the electorate in Scotland, and then to dismiss the result as being that of a mere subset of UK constituencies just because the result was not one to your pleasing. There’s that “except for voters in Scotland” again.

What these British apologists don’t seem to appreciate is that by making the arguments that they do, in their desperate attempts to fend off another independence referendum, they are making the case for independence. They are strengthening the arguments for independence. That’s because by their own actions they are demonstrating to the people of Scotland the utter futility of voting within the UK. They are proving that Scotland cannot have its needs met or its demands listened to within a UK context. They are telling voters in Scotland that there’s no point in voting because democracy doesn’t exist for Scotland as a constituent part of the UK. They are telling us all that the only way that Scotland can gets what it votes for is through independence. The UK is being strangled by those who claim to love it. Keep doing what you’re doing, guys, because you’re making independence nailed on.


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37 comments on “Except for voters in Scotland

  1. David Agnew says:

    We to need to start ditching Unionist parties in Scotland.

    The tories are a sub branch of an English party in Scotland.

    Labour are just grey slabs of shite, who will defend Union over Scotland.

    The lib dems, they’re what would happen if Ken Dodds diddy men quit light entertainment, and took up politics instead.

    Our votes dont count? I never want a unionist speaking for me and my nation if they wont challenge that.

  2. Dave tewart says:

    It’s coming for all that.
    My eldest brother has suddenly seen the light.
    He was watching the queen’s speech.
    Two things that hit the nail.
    1 The Rolls Royce to move the crown to parliament.
    2. The panto of 2 men carrying the hat and the sword also from a second Rolls Royce.
    The other things he mentioned was the old pals act of creating 2 new peers and coming in from a trip to the shops and seeing beggars on the street, ex army, cast aside.
    First time I’ve seen him in a number of long years actually SWITCH OFF the TV.

    An ex army voter who was indoctrinated by the armed forces and has suddenly snapped out of his JAIL.

    A new recruit created by doris himself and the panto season.
    Mundell got into the seat due to the vote being split 5 ways and FPTP gave him a small excess.
    Paul your words will come to haunt doris when his turn comes to be knifed by his party.

    We need a better system after we become a normal country again.

  3. Millsy says:

    Democracy ? That used to be a weird concept that applied to elections in the Greatest Most Successful Union the World has Ever Seen ( copyright pend. ).

    However , if you read the small print ( microscope required ) it clearly states that this concept can be withdrawn at any time by Westminster , particularly as it affects Scotlandshire !

    Under no circumstances is any vote ( even by 100% of the electorate ) for a Scotlandshire independence referendum to be considered sufficient mandate .

    Westminster’s appointed ambassador to Scotlandshire has been granted all powers necessary to accept/dismiss legislation emanating from the Scotlandshire Regional Assembly at Holyrood .

    The State Propaganda TV has been instructed to broadcast all matters that relate to how wee , poor and f*cking stupid the residents of Scotlandshire are compared to their beneficent southern neighbours who have selflessly supported Scotlandshire’s parasitical and thankless people since God created Engerland .

    In the event of Scotlandshire’s irredeemably stupid electorate refusing to see the error of their ways and continuing to vote in ( rigged ) elections for parties that are not Boris friendly , then the All-powerful one will have no recourse but to implement the nuclear option of a Mooth Davidson skinny-dipping festival at a loch near you – every day and twice on Sundays !

  4. John docherty says:

    Gonna be the first to say so
    Was actually quite looking forward to Davidson skinny dipping broadcast .
    Friends and family will confirm my being a wee bit odd

    • Cubby says:

      GROSS. Seek help. LOL

    • Bob Lamont says:

      Aside distorting global warming effects by raising the Loch an inch, what on earth made you think her media buddies would broadcast such a humiliation… No no no no, it would be an announcement such as “a highly placed conservative has confirmed today…” without her leaving home…
      As to your other possible motivation, Specsavers do have some fabulous offers these days 🤣

    • Catherine Crerar says:

      Maybe I’m a conspiracy theorist but Ruth Davidson knew the SNP were going to get in the high forties and the skinny dipping at 50 seats, I’m quite sure was a usual attempt to clip our wings and gaslight the public into seeing a resounding SNP victory as some sort of failure. If so, how did she know though when the Ipsos MORI Exit poll was up at 55?

  5. […] Wee Ginger Dug Except for voters in Scotland Can you hear that sound? It’s the sound of ferrets reversing. It’s the sound that […]

  6. Dave Hansell says:

    Some observations, if I may:

    The arguments you have constructed in this piece are soundly based on objective rational logic and evidence. No sane rational person can refute the objective reality and scientific methodology basis of what you have described.

    In essence one way of describing the position of what you term ‘hypocrisy’ and ‘double standards’ in play here is to say that the Tories and other Unionists are redefining reality to suit themselves.

    They are saying ‘this is so because I say it is so’ regardless of objective reality.

    This represents a position in which those individuals and groups who adopt it are making a claim based on their subjective opinion, with no need for supporting objective evidence, and insisting that every individual and institution accepts and adopts their subjective version of reality.

    The shorthand way of describing this is self- definition or self-identification based on subjective opinion rather than observed and testable, with evidence, objective reality.

    Now. Someone please present a coherent evidence based objective argument that this position you have cogently laid out is a single iota different to the argument Campbell is pursuing over at Wings.

    • Cubby says:

      Took your advice – looked at Wings – wished I hadn’t. Didn’t loiter – bloody awful site now.

    • andyfromdunning says:

      Correct.

      No idea why people are attacking Wings when he is making an opinion on the date of indyref2 based on logic and evidence in a similar way Paul is here.

      I understand people may object as their wish and opinions differ from logic. This does not however change fact.

      There are however unforeseen events that may happen to change objective logic. For example Boris has a mystical change to make him say Yes.

      • Cubby says:

        “This does not however change fact” – what fact would that be – just trying to understand what you are saying because at present I don’t have a clue what you are on about.

        The Wings site owner is like a football manager congratulating himself on winning the league beore the first match has commenced play on the basis of his analysis of the situation. Pick your own word to describe this.

    • Dave, we are talking about FPTP and proportional representation here.
      Nice of you to drop in. Do wrap up warm on the way home. ‘Bye.

      • Dave Hansell says:

        And the subject is based on what methodology, Jack?

        Objective evidence or subjective self defined opinion that something is so because someone insists it is so on the pain of punitive measures against anyone who disagrees?

        Whatever the example or subject it has to be based on sound objective evidence. Wishful thinking is not going to do the business, as any engineer will attest.

        Have a good Christmas and New Year and don’t believe all those little lies about a jolly man with a red coat and white beard because the point of getting us to believe in the little lies is to prepare us to believe in the big lies.

    • weegingerdug says:

      And you win the prize for trying to shoehorn a comment about gender identity into a response to an article about something else entirely. Well done you.

      • Dave Hansell says:

        And you win a prize for proving Campbell’s point – which is that subjective self defined opinion cannot override objective reality. No matter how much anyone jumps up and down and insists something is so because they say it is so.

        In this case subjectively insisting that the point being made is entirely about the example being used to make the point. Thereby missing the point entirely.

  7. Cubby says:

    Excellent article.

    So so sick of the Britnat lies and misrepresentation.

  8. The British Parliament never has been a Democracy. It was a 4 year, now a 5-year Dictatorship.

  9. I don’t know about the rest of you, but I am struggling to work up the spirit of Peace and Good Will to all mankind this year.
    On the 28th of December we commemorate the Feast of the Slaughter of the Holy Innocents.

    When King Herod The Great, who had form killing 3 of his own sons, heard that Christ The King was born, and that he would be crowned The King of the Jews, he ordered his army to scour Bethlehem and slaughter every male child under the age of two.

    Now that King Boris the Great has ascended the throne with a FPTP majority, he has the power of Herod over his subjects.
    Universal Credit will continue, and we will be held under house arrest in Scotland from Jan 31st 2020.
    We will be forbidden to wander freely at will throughout our own continent.

    If any of you are working and have three or more children, and your boss lays you off, not only will you and your family have to get by on poverty 5 year benefit capped hand outs, child three, child four or whatever, will be ‘slaughtered’ , starved by politicians as collateral damage as the fight against austerity ramps up, more cash for the rich, more pain and privation for the many. This will continue for at least another 5, probably10, and maybe 15 years.

    In one Parliament alone, when the Lib Dems were in coalition with the Blue Tories, it is reckoned that 120,000 UK citizens met premature deaths because of cuts to welfare and sickness benefits.

    Do the maths.

    Another 360,000 of our poorest citizens condemned to death by Far Right Political edict, while failed sub Lieutenant Andrew Bowie smirks, and Willie Rennie screams that the mental health among teenagers is all Nicola Sturgeon’s fault.

    I challenge the so called ‘socialists’ in the Labour Branch Office.

    Are you prepared to let this carry on for another 15 years, or even, FFS, five years?

    Neil Findlay, Alec Rowley, Monica Lennon, Johann Lamont, there are no ‘free things’. Never have been.

    You are backing Boris Johnson, Jacob Rees Mogg and the little toad Bowie in denying the people of Scotland food on the table, a roof over their heads, heat warmth and clothing and the right to choose?
    You will have the blood of tens of thousands Scots who die prematurely because you deny your country, Scotland, its right to consider an alternative.

    Ding don merrily on high, my erse.

    Paul, your measured rage cam through evry word. Well done.

    Neil Findlay; look in the mirror, son.
    They are slaughtering our innocents.
    Any pastor, priest, or rabbi who wants to quote from my rant over ‘the holidays’ feel free.

    • Cubby says:

      “So called socialists” is spot on Jack. So many of these so called socialists sitting in the House of Lords wearing their funny coats every so often to distinguish themselves from the plebs.

      Labour – socialists – what a joke. FRAUDS that’s what they are.

      People who vote British Labour in Scotland thinking they are voting for a socialist party are being taken for a ride.

      • Welsh Sion says:

        In 1945, the Labour Party secured a landslide in the British General Election. I guess (as it was before my time) that they touted themselves as ‘Socialists’.

        My father mentioned the election result to *his* father, adding that now the ‘Socialists’ were in power, they (the Welsh peasantry) could now see the back of the local squire, Sir Michael Duff-Assheton-Smith, Bart., Godson of Queen Mary of Teck, Mayor of Caernarvon, High Sheriff of Caernarvonshire and Lord Lieutenant of both Caernarvonshire and of Gwynedd. He owned all the local smallholdings and the local slate quarry as well as a 100 acre estate.

        What I think in Scotland, you call a Laird, and is known everywhere, as a (k)nob.

        Anyhow, my dad was convinced that a new (Red) dawn was breaking. My grandfather looked him straight in the eye, and replied, in Welsh:

        “Aye, we probably will now see the back of Sir. Michael. But don’t forget. This crew want to get to his place by clambering onto your shoulders.”

  10. Bob Lamont says:

    Bravo Sir, cannot disagree one iota..
    Happened to watch the Bowie/Blackford exchange as it was headlined Blackford’s humiliation on YouTube https://youtu.be/wC2FiajJ7Lo
    and was left more than a little non-plussed at the total idiocy of the headline, and the turning off for comments on the publication knowing folks such as myself would post “WTF humiliation, Bowie’s an arse wi teeth” or similar….
    The establishment really are terrified when they resort to such obvious tactics, and even though I empathise with impatience of many over SNP’s caution, I can only suggest leave them to it..
    Right now by all evidence thus far seen, the Union propaganda machine is digging itself a grave… Bravo Sub-Lieutenant Bowie your Queen thanks you for your continued loyal service, this is most definitely your last tour of “duty”….

  11. Dave tewart says:

    Total agreement Jack.

    The pagan feast of the lengthening day in the Northern Hemisphere is near.

    We used to have the Gold Standard as the basis of monetary control until some one realised that the planet doesn’t have enough so enter FIAT money.
    We get MPs getting upset when one of the band says there’s no money left when they know we just print more as we need it.

    Smoke and mirrors.

    Who decided that wild salmon were the property of the local landowner, yep he did, he was the only one who could vote for his MP.

    A passer by from another planet looking at the way we allow ourselves to be manipulated would wonder at our idea that we are the intelligent life form on the planet Earth.
    You know the one we are gradually destroying along with life.

    Note even in the Pacific the island of Bougainville has just voted to be an ordinary country.

    Taking a crown to parliament in a Rolls Royce, they’re nutters.
    A parliament which doesn’t have enough seats for the members.
    Two aircraft carriers with only one aircraft.

    Aye empire 11 is up and running.

    Even the Jewish religion’s leaders don’t really think Jesus Christ was a Jew who lived in Palestine.
    We have Christians who won’t let children from the same area into the UK but profess to be believers in a religion from the same area.

    Go Figure as the Americans say.

    • Cubby says:

      “A parliament which doesn’t have enough seats for its members”

      Looks like we will be doing them a favour when the 59 Scots no longer need a seat and of course no more Scottish Lords/Ladies being created will help in the other place.

      So the ending of the Treaty of Union 1707 will have something good for them.

  12. Bob Lamont says:

    PS – Finally got to listen to FM’s questions on her Statement yesterday thanks to https://indyref2.space/forum/
    and was amazed that every one of the questions levelled by journos were from the HMG storyline, and fair-play she defended and let no cats out of any bags. Yet why are none of the journos addressing the positives of Indy? Because it worked so well in 2014?
    The usual “once in a generation” line propaganda in play but she acquitted herself well, yet make no mistake, we’re in for a fight, not with the population but the media…

    • Cubby says:

      It was hard at times to make out the questioners identity but it seemed to me that everyone was a hardline Britnat question. Was the National not represented or were they not asked?

      Anyway Nicola Sturgeon has the patience of a saint in dealing with these Britnat journalists. Loads of boneheaded questions. The worst was ” the weasel” from the Daily Redcoat. After Nicola had patiently explained to another Britnat journalist that no politician can bind the hands of another future politician or indeed the people of Scotland the weasel asks if she loses an Indyref2 will she then commit to no more indyrefs. Can a weasel be boneheaded? Hutcheon says yes.

  13. Robert Graham says:

    To all SNP politicians please resist having to justify why we want this Union dissolved ,
    The evidence and the financial figures forget them this Unionist media ain’t listening , the endless questions about currency and what colour bog roll we would use , its all just froth and meant to confuse ,getting stuck in the Minutia is pointless and only helps one side , The Unionist Media only want an excuse to attempt to twist and distort any answer given

    Question what currency would a independent Scotland use – Answer our own currency just the same as every other nation on the Planet does , next Question .

    Forget these banal mind numbing Questions focus on what we want to achieve conversely a different approach is required with people who need convincing to vote with us ,People who actually have a vote they need to be nurtured and made to feel as if it’s for their own good , usually it only needs a few reassuring facts.

    Dealing with a Hostile Media means keeping it simple , and not getting sidetracked insisting the question asked be answered in full before the next load of Tripe is asked ,if the interviewer persists make it personal attack their obvious bias .

  14. Catherine Julie Kerr says:

    Paul, you were going to have a wee holiday!! Great article

  15. Petra says:

    The lying, abject failure pops up like a bl**dy Jack in a box, ready to burst a blood vessel. Have you ever heard of anything more ridiculous than, eh, Brexit means Brexit? Why on earth would the EU not want Scotland as a member, with 1% of the EU population contributing oil, gas and renewable energy (and the rest). MUCH more than England, FGS. https://mobile.twitter.com/RobDunsmore/status/1207957842277347329?s=20

  16. Cubby says:

    Silly silly Kirsty Wark on Newsnight actually says in 10 years time Britain may consist of just England and Wales. What the hell – is Scotland going to be sunk into the North Sea and disappear completely Kirsty.

    These Britnats heads are so full of lies and nonsense about the UK they cannot even handle basic geography in the event of Scotland being independent. Their brains seem to freeze when contemplating the matter.

  17. Alba woman says:

    Scotland is challenging Dominic and Boris’s version of Populism which is another version of right wing abuse of power.

    Scotland is up for the challenge with Nicola working hard to deal with these people. She requires full support in dealing with this onerous challenge……the eyes of the world are watching how all this turns out.

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