The Court of Session has decided to delay giving a ruling on the nobile officium case brought against the Prime Minister by the SNP MP Joanna Cherry, the legal campaigner Jolyon Maugham, and the anti-Brexit businessman Dale Vince. The court has said that it must wait until the political situation has played itself out, pointing out that the Prime Minister has until 19 October to sign the letter to the EU asking for an extension to Article 50. He will only be in breach of the law if he has not signed the letter by that date. The court has said that if he does not sign the letter by that date, then the plaintiffs will be able to return to court on Monday 21 October and the judges will then make a definitive decision on how to proceed. This is the legal equivalent of yer granny getting a wet tea towel out, ready to flick you on the head with it if you don’t eat your dinner.
The Government wanted the Court of Session to dismiss the case. The judges have very conspicuously failed to do so. Instead they delayed a ruling and have put the Prime Minister on notice that the court expects him to obey the law and fulfil his promises to the court that he will do so. And if he does not, then the court will consider what further action to take. The Court of Session could sign the letter in his place, using the powers of that obscure legal mechanism that now everyone is talking about. The judges could hold the Prime Minister in contempt, and we’d be in the previously unthinkable situation of a British Prime Minister being in contempt of the highest court in Scotland.
If he set foot in Scotland after being ruled in contempt of the highest court in the land, it is even possible – albeit unlikely – that he could be arrested. Now that would be fun to watch, more fun than any number of milkshakes. It would be a delicious situation where the British Prime Minister was afraid to come to Scotland because he was afraid of getting arrested. It would make for a very interesting General Election campaign. The PM could be invited to an electoral debate in Scotland and be empty platformed with just a pair of handcuffs in his place. I’d give up that £170 million winning Euromillions ticket for that to happen. If I had it. Which sadly I don’t. I did win £10.80 though. So whoop, and dee doo.
The decision of the Scottish court creates yet more pressure on Lyin’ Bastert Johnson to do what the Benn Act requires of him, something which he is still saying that he won’t do. He still wants us to think that there’s a ditch with his name on it that he’s going to die in. But this is man who doesn’t do the dying himself, he gets others to do it for him. Today’s decision to delay a final ruling until after the cut off date of 19 October restricts the Prime Minister’s options even further. It makes it even more difficult for him to come up with some clever clever ruse to get around the Benn Act, as the Scottish court will expect him to obey both the letter and the spirit of the law, as he promised to do in the UK government’s deposition to the judges.
However this is a Prime Minister who may very well simply refuse to obey the law and to defy attempts to challenge him. According to The Sun – well yeah, I know, but – sources in Number 10 are claiming that even if there is a vote of No Confidence in the Commons after 21 October, Downing Street is planning to tell the Queen that she can’t remove him as Prime Minister. He’s just going to squat there to ensure that the UK crashes out of the EU on 31 October without a deal. That would ensure that the UK takes another step closer to an authoritarian state where the Hedge Fund party trashes our rights and our economic prospects in order to benefit disaster capitalism, all the while screaming 17.4 million voters!, WW2!, will of the people! This is the great danger of that unwritten constitution that British nationalists always preened themselves made the UK better than other countries, while not being nationalist about it at all. Oh no.
It is unthinkable that we have to raise this as a possibility, as unthinkable as raising the possibility that a British Prime Minister might be unable to set foot in Scotland for fear of arrest, but this is the crazy that passes for that security and stability of the British state that Scotland was promised in 2014. Long gone are the days when the biggest insanity of the British Government was Gordie Broon throwing a Nokia at the head of some hapless spad.
Meanwhile there have been briefings from Downing Street that in the General Election that’s coming, the Conservative Party will be seeking a mandate for a no-deal Brexit. Alarmed by this, a group of those one nation Tory MPs who haven’t yet been purged from the party sought a meeting with Lyin’ Bastert Johnson, during which he denied that this would be his manifesto commitment. It’s just that none of them believe him. The problem with being a serial liar is that no one believes you, even if by some miracle you are actually telling the truth. Which on this occasion he probably isn’t. A manifesto commitment to a no-deal Brexit would probably wipe out the Conservatives in Scotland. Clouds and silver linings and all that.
There is to be a special sitting of Parliament on Saturday 19 October. That will be the day when time runs out. Either the British Government will present a deal to the House for its approval, a deal which there is currently no sign of it getting, or it will have to ask the EU for an extension. If neither of those things happen, then the House can debate what next steps to take. MPs could decide to authorise someone else, such as the Speaker, to write to the EU to make the formal request for an extension. There could be a vote of no confidence and the Commons appoints a caretaker Prime Minister. Your guess about what is going to happen is as good as anyone else’s, because no one in any position of authority has a scooby either.
None of this really matters though, because two footballers’ wives have been falling out over what one of them claims that the other has leaked from the first one’s instagram account. The British media is less interested in barristers’ wigs than it is in WAGs. The only scooby that counts is the Scooby gang that Colleen Rooney has been playing at. Rebekah Vardy – no I hadn’t heard of her either – would have got away with it if it wasn’t for those pesky kids. Who needs the Court of Session possibly about to hold the Prime Minister in contempt, who cares about the impending collapse of what passes for a British constitution, who needs to bother about the British government’s transformation into the sort of authoritarianism that would do Regip Erdogan proud.
When the history of this period in British history is written, the history of the final years of the UK before it breaks up, the history of the British state’s descent into drooling senescence, the British media will get a lot of the blame. They’re obsessed with the wrong sort of scooby.
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[…] Wee Ginger Dug The wrong sort of scooby The Court of Session has decided to delay giving a ruling on the nobile officium case […]
What a Scooby doo-doo all this is!
Sill trying to undstand why a respected and capable SNP politician would pursue a number of legal actions with intent to delay or derail a democratic decision that provides the ideal circumstances for Scottish independence. I know it’s her profession, but can somebody not have a quiet word….?
Because it’s not a Scottish democratic decision.
Yes, I appreciate that, but it wasn’t a Scottish referendum – it was a UK decision. The United Kingdom exits the EU. Democratically, that is the only outcome that can prevail. The one necessary decision that needs to be made is whether Scotland remains in the EU or the UK. If the principal objective of the SNP is an independent Scotland, wouldn’t it make sense to facilitate and support any mechanism that secures – rather than impedes – that goal?
Being seen to facilitate Brexit would destroy the SNP in Scotland. Brexit is bad for Scotland and Scotland doesn’t want it. The SNP has to be seen to be resisting something that is so damaging to Scottish interests. If they are seen to facilitate Brexit, that would be 1979 on steroids. The party would not recover for a generation or more.
I believe that the calculation that the SNP leadership is making is that Brexit will happen or not happen according to English political pressures. Scotland is a mere onlooker. We can’t prevent Brexit happening. Under those circumstances it’s better for the SNP to be seen to be Scotland’s champion. Then when Brexit does happen, as it probably will, the electorate will see that it’s the SNP which has been the solid and consistent defender of Scottish interests. And if Brexit can be avoided, then the SNP will still be seen as a solid and consistent voice defending Scottish interests.
I don’t believe that holding another indy referendum is contingent upon Brexit happening – it’s merely the most blatant example of a material change in circumstances, it’s not the only one. The way Scotland has been treated by Westminster over the course of the past three years is in itself enough of a material change in circumstances to press for another indy ref. Even if Brexit can be avoided, it’s going to poison British politics for a decade to come.
Perhaps keeping schtum might be a better policy. Imagine if the Scottish referendum had provided the opposite to what transpired – and Westminster tried to overturn the result with a series of legal challenges…. What might your view be then?
The Scottish electorate has been very clear that it doesn’t want Brexit. The only mandate the SNP needs to respect is a Scottish one.
Agreed. But the only democratic course to take would be to recognise that fact and ensure Scotland remains in the EU – that means dissolving our Union with England – not seek to impair our neighbour’s democratically declared destiny! If you’re leaving your abusive partner for a true love, you don’t need to ask their permission – or go to court to try and prevent them from self-harming…
Citing the Scottish referendum is not a legitimate comparison as that was purely a Scottish matter ; the fact that Scotland overwhelmingly voted to remain ( in the EU ) is a another issue .
Imagine if the vote had been swung ( either way ) by the votes of Scots – would many people in be content to accept this without argument ?
It’s that simple ?
I’ve been wondering about that and the only answer I could come up with was that the SNP would be destroyed if they voted for brexit but I just always thought there must be another reason that I don’t know about or don’t understand.
Yup. 🙂
Probably also worth noting that the SNP wears two hats of necessity (one a bit tighter than the other).
The government hat (under current system and remit) has its… drawbacks…in times of constitutional crisis.
Hi Sam – for sure. But one is too big and the brim has slipped down over the eyes presently. I’m sure somebody will tip it back soon!
The premise “pursue a number of legal actions with intent to delay or derail a democratic decision” is a perspective widely broadcast by a subset of politicians and media intent on discrediting the motives of the plaintiffs and judiciary, not sure where “democratically declared destiny” comes from or what it actually means, but what is the reality?
All legal actions headlined by Miller and Cherry since 2016 (Miller for much longer before) have sought to ensure the executive abide by rule of law and the democratic will of Parliament.
The latest actions were raised to prevent the executive circumventing a legal obligation to avert “No Deal” as initiated by Parliament, so the Court of Session and Supreme Court were not frustrating democracy but reinforcing it.
Far from needing “a quiet word”, Cherry’s actions have restored much needed faith in a political system which has become rogue, and enhancing the standing of SNP north and south in the process is no bad thing either.
That these actions incurred the wrath of the rich minority who stood to financially gain from such a “No Deal” course was evident from the venom in MSM headlines, but who is the ultimate defender of democracy, the Law Lords or Jonathan Harmsworth ?
True “delay or derail” of Brexit lay with Tory “red-lines” at the beginning, rebellion by ERG, DUP, and others at the end preventing Brexit becoming law in April 2019.
Ask yourself why “No Deal” was so important and to whom, and you will find $ with lots of trailing zeroes.
Both Brexit and Indy2 are inevitable, averting the financial chaos of “No Deal” does not alter the ultimate outcome, think of it as divorce settlement where the ex was prevented from burning the house down. 😉
Hello Bob – I think the motives of the plaintiffs and judiciary were admirable, well-intentioned and perfectly understandable, given what’s at stake – but ultimately I think they were wrong. For sure, I agree that the government should abide by the rule of law and the democratic will of parliament – but ultimately, it’s the democratic will of the people that is paramount. Our politicians are supposed to represent their constituents views and wishes – and that is where one problem lies.
All the points you raise concerning deals are valid and well made, but unfortunately they are irrelevant. There was no mention of a deal or a reference to terms and conditions when the referendum was held. It was a simple yes or no. That was another problem. All the points you raise should have been made before the vote so people could make an informed choice. But that’s not how our modern society and media works. That’s another problem.
I also agree with your comments regarding qui bono. People will make money whatever the outcome – that only exemplifies the utter corruption in the financial sector – and many others stand to lose a great deal. Don’t you think it strange how all the most deprived regions in England & Wales voted to leave – even though the poorest will be “hardest hit” according to the media. I don’t agree. The poorest have nothing already. That don’t have any further to fall. They have learned to survive. They have nothing except resilience. And they are many.
Scotland has had a choice for over three years. The really unfortunate thing was the independence referendum, had it not taken place in 2014, I suspect this discussion would be academic. England needs to exit from the EU as quickly as possible and once somebody switches the fan off, we can get about the business of clearing up the shit. Scotland has a bright future in Europe – just get on with it and stop interfering in the essential reforms your southerly neighbours have to get on with.
We are not interfering in our southerly neighbours business as long as we are in the UK as mandated by the NO vote in 2014. That means we are getting on with OUR business and trying to prevent Brexit in accordance with OUR Remain Mandate .
Spot on Kangaroo.
The “democratic will of the people” is expressed in those they elect to parliament which then takes on delivering the mandate.
HMG cases such as these have sought to curb executive intent to flout law and parliamentary sovereignty, it matters not whether you judge it wrong, that is how the UK system works. The Court of Session was available when the Supreme Court was not, so your view it is “interfering” with “southerly neighbours” is incorrect, it was playing it’s part in the UK system, Cherry was lead petitioner, a Scot, a SNP MP, but crucially a QC.
Having watched the anti-EU propaganda ramp up over decades from abroad, Brexit is but one aspect of the madness with which MSM and rich elites have engulfed England, “17.4 million” is still being flogged to death alongside distortion over what Leave voted for.
Less than a third of the electorate decided the EU fate of the UK 3 years ago, and NOBODY was talking other than the best and easiest deal in history. That was the context of the 2016 referendum and the 2017 snap election, to imply the method of departure was open to a “No Deal” option is bunkum circulated by those with a very different agenda than simply leaving the EU.
To repeat, were it not for the concerted efforts of ERG etc to scupper May’s deal the UK would now be 6 months into transition, it is they who are not serving the “democratic will of the people” to facilitate escape for their paymasters before 2020 and cause maximal damage to the EU. That meant “No Deal” in 2019, hence installing the charlatan as PM and talking up Remainer conspiracies to absolve themselves from the mess Brexit is in.
What these chaos-engineers did not foresee was Parliament voting “No Deal” off the table and enacting law to ensure it.
English politics, government, and media are exposed to the world as a corrupt mess, but the aspirations of Scots for Independence is shared abroad and in England, it is only now a matter of when.
Morning Bob – agree wholeheartedly with your excellent synopsis and once again the petitioner’s motives are understandable. But assuming the SNP’s principal objective is to secure Scottish independence, what would best facilitate that aim? A hard brexit with no deal with no agreement on borders or trade – or a soft brexit, with agreements on customs, trade and freedom of movement?
Or put another way….the Tory party are intent on creating the perfect circumstances to enable Scottish independence. A significant number of the ERG group would indeed welcome dissolution of our Union, for any number of reasons. We don’t have to like them and we certainly don’t have to agree with their views or ideology, but consider the bigger picture – on this one issue, why are we trying to stop them?
Morning Mark – “No Deal” Brexit undoubtedly creates the most damage thereby accelerates Indy support, but ultimately any form of Brexit will drive the cause of independence as it highlights our democratic impotence within the UK. Paul listed the potential damage of alternative strategies, so far SNP has earned plaudits across Europe for it’s stance, not bad publicity for them and highlights the merits of Independence.
You still don’t grasp that we are NOT trying to stop them, these Court cases are not Scots attempts to stop the lunatics, the case could have been raised in England but for circumstances, Cherry is acting as any MP should, but rarely under such a spotlight.
The supporters of Cherry’s case are a long list of predominantly English politicians, and with SNP a minority in Parliament unable to influence much, those ‘friends’ may prove sympathetic allies when the Indy starting gun is fired.
Opinion on SNP is already high across Europe despite MSM negativity at home, but with sympathy for Independence rising in England, we will get there soon enough.. 😉
Let’s hope so. We are seemingly in a tunnel with a deal in sight – conditional to a further confirmatory vote in Northern Ireland – if these reports are accurate. No mention of Scotland. Best wishes.
Seemingly the Attorney General Geoffrey ”cocky” Cox has threatened to resign if LBJ doesn’t to write to the EU asking for a Brexit extension. If true he’s not being so cocky now, is he?
http://www.thenational.scot/news/17924566.leaked-document-shows-geoffrey-cox-advised-prorogation-legal/
Joanna Cherry plus a number of videos:- https://twitter.com/joannaccherry?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Eauthor
Worth a wee read:- https://twitter.com/CrossgateCentre/status/1181669502175600642
If BoJo does break the law,again,can we have a European Arrest Warrant issued?
Dragged off in chains to the Hague,what a wonderful prospect.
Ha ha you beat me to it. I was going to suggest that for a laugh and it would be hilarious if it it happened.
I don’t understand why he has to be in Scotland to be arrested. Surely the Met would serve a Scottish arrest warrant, or are we separate countries already.
Because it was funnier to put it that way.
If the polis don’t step in I’m sure there’s a fair few flok up here that would volunteer to make a citizen’s arrest when he ventures over the border. 🙂
I think it should be “British Politics _is_ so insane” not “are”
Watching news night tonight the word Scotland not mentioned.and like watching many other political programs.scotland does not get mentioned.we Scotland are totally irrelevant.totally ignored.Scotland wake up all you undecided voters.the quicker we get out of this discredited so called union.the better roll on independence.
“The problem with being a serial liar is that no one believes you, even if by some miracle you are actually telling the truth”
The problem can be that people become so used to the lies they don’t even notice any more. I think many in the UK are already in that position with this PM.
Good call. Something what I writ a wee while ago…
“I’d say that what we’ve been witnessing for quite some time, is the normalisation of deceit.
That it becomes acceptable as a strategy, not just for the political class, but to the public. That WE find it acceptable to dump on each other. That it’s okay to lie to each other. That it’s just peachy to manipulate, misrepresent, sow discord and mistrust in society, because that’s how you do business. Uh Huh! Just business, (just so long as my tribe wins something), and there won’t be any fallout or collateral damage. Honest guv’nor.
Except… there is.
It begins with trust and works its way on up the food chain of worthy human traits from there. Care, empathy, mercy, selflessness, courage. You name it, they’ll all take a battering. When we can’t trust our administrators and representatives, our institutions, or each other. What is there left that’s worth having? The win?
What Westminster’s political practices, (both historic and current), have taught us, is how NOT to conduct your politics. How NOT to administer for those in your care. How NOT to treat those who pay your damn wages.
Probably worth remembering, like.”
NICE Macart , I like what you say
Indeed. Well said, Macart, but mind that the media also had a huge part to play in this. By failing to hold British nationlist politicians to account, by failing to ask the awkward questions that really needed to be asked, our so called journalists have failed us miserably and given power to the fibbers. Hell mend em.
Well said, Sir.
Yep… Well said indeed..
Many years ago Macart a few of us used to play cards lunchtime at school, small stakes, poker, pontoon, brag. Most of us had a Saturday job or something. There was one guy who used to clown about, dealing off the bottom, dropping cards, turning them over “for fun”. You got used to it.
Anyways, one time playing 3 card brag I had 3 kings. After a couple of rounds with fairly small raises there were just two of us left, everyone else had stacked. My bet. What do you do? You raise of course, and big!
Suddenly I realised the one left was him – and he’d dealt. So I saw him and right enough he had 3 threes – the highest hand in our rules for 3 card brag.
Taught me an early lesson. Don’t gamble basically!
But also as you say, “the normalisation of deceit”.
I’d like to see countermeasures in our education system from an early stage, not long after P1 preferably. I was lucky. 5.4 million Scots and 60 million from the rUK aren’t so lucky.
Neatly done dads and well said. 😉
At this point I think Boris not sending the letter and triggering a hard Brexit might actually be some kind of relief from this insanity. There’s no Alexander to take the sword to the Gordian Knot so another extension just means more of the same while the UK slowly bleeds to death as all the foreign businesses (apart from the money launderers) pack their bags and leave. The car industry is already in tatters.
The expectation that somehow there will be a defining moment and everyone will spring into action and the situation will be resolved is looking more and more delusional. The calamity of Brexit is already on us. The country is either going to be destroyed quickly or slowly – pick one.
A refreshing change to read real debate, stating points of view politely and with a genuine interests in the other’s opinion, instead of the usual claptrap spouted from the BritNats on other comments spaces.
The SNP policy of trying to prevent brexit, is paying off with more people turning to support independence and former nos now undecided.
Hopefully we may see 70% plus when the referendum happens.
Reblogged this on mikeinkwazi.
I don’t want to be a grammar Nazi, Paul, but in Scotland it’s ‘pursuer’ , or ‘petitioner’
Reblogged this on Ramblings of a 50+ Female.
Yet another excellent effort Paul , one of many produced over the last few months . This in tandem with ” Phantom Powers series of videos ” the reason I mention these efforts is I am reading the latest in a series of e/mails from Petter Murrel reminding me of my last chance of a pass to the next conference ,Well that’s nice Peter I hadn’t noticed a conference was coming up ,
A wee bit of advice rather than waste time and effort with never read leaflets and MSM boycotted conferences why don’t the SNP support real effective promotion of Independence such as funding the production of these posters and the people who actually do the work unpaid for the most part.
Support financially Paul and this site- Phantom Power- Indylive Radio – and all the other unsung heroes who day and daily do all the really hard graft, I believe there are a lot of folk who would dig deep ,a fragmented effort is just that fragmented, get it together and do it now please just a thought .
Can the Scottish government do that Robert Graham ?
Or do you mean the SNP
The SNP are the Government!! They manage the civil service.
Many SNP members are active in Yes groups but the SNP as a party has done no active pro indy work on our streets for five years. We the Yes groups were told to campaign now, we never stopped but the SNP never started. I vote SNP by the way and have since 2007.
I think you know the answer Terry because any impropriety by the SNP in government would be headline news , much the same as Glasgow’s Provost clothing allowance hit the headlines before she even got a chance to put her new coat on , every corner there is a wee clipe just waiting .
It looks as though people don’t even dig deep for the SNP, Robert. Have you ever checked out donations to their party in comparison to the Tories, Labour and Libdems? A drop in the ocean in comparison. It looked to me as though SIC was going to become the “umbrella group” and deal with such issues, but I have no idea what’s going on there now other than they didn’t even achieve their crowdfunding goal either.
Just catching up with the posts and was about to reply in much the same terms as you have done. The SNP does not have much by way of income other than its membership fees. The party no longer has any big donors therefore money is tight. Furthermore some very large sums have been donated elsewhere to what effect remains to be seen.
Once the date is set for indyref then the Scottish Government will be able to use the resources available to the Government in pursuit of its manifesto promises but they will not be limitless and will be constrained by rules and regulations that apply to any Government and its use of public funds/resources in pursuit of its policies. Therefore the SNP, the party, will still require funding in order to contribute to the campaign in ways that the Scottish Government cannot.
And that is where we need to focus, outside the political box constrained by HMG. Non?
Oui but you still need money.
I think we are already seeing the effects Legerwood and they are proving to be, basically (worryingly and sadly), “counterproductive”.
They also seem to be increasing in sound, fury and misrepresentation of what is actually happening and almost all being stirred from a single source that is acting like a dog with a bone.
“Someone else” is pulling the strings, advising, and the “misrepresentation” will be ramped up the closer we get to achieving our objective. Who would ever have envisaged this happen? More so what to do about it?
In other parts of this Disunited Kingdumb:
https://nation.cymru/news/senedd-backs-bilingual-name-change-and-votes-for-16-years-old/
Excellent
If he set foot in Scotland after being ruled in contempt of the highest court in the land, it is even possible – albeit unlikely – that he could be arrested.
WHY. Thats what’s wrong with this bloody place. If it was one of us poor plebs, albeit unlikely would not enter the mind of the law they would be down on us like a ton of bricks
Witnessed this in Dumbarton Sheriff court.
Man in the dock asked how was he pleading to the charge.
He said ‘I might as well plead guilty as I won’t get a fair hearing’
Bully of a Sheriff say to Police present ‘Take this man to the Cells’
Two big polis did as directed.
Brought back up at the end of the session, Sheriff admonished him on the charge.
Then FINED him for Contempt of HIS court, heavy fine.
Our judges will be looking after their retirement and so won’t be rushing to having doris lifted.
Just a little piece of history now but sums up your point, IF I was to have one thing said in court and then outside say I didn’t agree with the LAW I’d be back in court. Not so doris, he’s one of the exceptionalist, he didn’t get lifted for owning up to using class A drugs.
Sky news are saying that the river Thames is polluted with cocaine. So it’s not the streets paved with gold it’s the river submerged in cocaine.
The court of session does not have to rule on anything. The Supreme Court has already ruled that the English Parliament is sovereign. this being the case it has also ruled that the Scottish people are sovereign. Therefore the Scottish people can vote to dissolve the Union any time they so wish.