Scottish democracy would be a good idea

There are many reasons for Scottish independence. We each have our own individual reasons for wanting to see Scotland regain its place amongst the independent states of this world. One of my reasons is to remove the obscenity of weapons of mass destruction from the Clyde. I’ve wanted to see the back of them ever since I was a child and decades later they’re still there. Trident missiles only exist in order to boost the flaccid penis of a post-imperial state, and only independence will see Scotland free from the radioactive stain that the leave on our landscape. At least suspicious stains on bed sheets don’t have the ability to wipe out half the planet.

I want independence because it’s only with independence that Scotland can have a referendum on whether we should become a republic or remain a monarchy. The chances that the Westminster parliament will ever permit a referendum on the future of the monarchy are approximately the same as the chances that Ruth Davidson can say or do something that doesn’t involve her own self-promotion. So that’s as close to zero as makes no difference. She makes Kanye West seem modest and self-effacing, and he’s actually got a modicum of talent. Apart from ruthless self-promotion, Ruth’s only talent lies in finding new ways of saying she doesn’t want another independence referendum. And truth be told she’s not even very good at that.

Another, and far more personal, reason for wanting Scottish independence became clear to me when I did a talk with the dug in Forres last year. During the Q&A session afterwards, a man put up his hand and made the observation that when Scotland becomes independent, we’ll have our stamps. It will be great for Scotland to have its own stamps, but even those of us who were interested in stamp collecting when we were young lose all interest in it just as soon as we discover sex and drugs and rock and roll, so I wasn’t really sure where the man was going with this observation. Independent countries have their own stamps.

Although probably according to the Unionists Scotland will be uniquely incapable of having its own stamps, just like its apparently and uniquely incapable of having its own currency. I do seem to recall that during the independence campaign of 2014 Unionists did actually cite the inability of independence campaigners to say how much a first class stamp would cost after independence as an example of the horrendous uncertainty that independence would create. They’re quite relaxed about the horrendous uncertainty of Brexit, because after all, you’ll still know how much a first class stamp costs even though you won’t have a job, you’ll need a visa to travel to France, Northern Ireland will have descended into civil war, the devolution settlement will be in ruins, the economy will be tanking and the pound will be on a par with the cowrie shell. But we’ll still know how much a first class stamp costs. Unless the post office raises the price, which they’re quite likely to do. So we won’t know how much a first class stamp costs after all. But it will still have the Queen’s head on it, and it won’t be polluted by the words “Scotland – Alba”, so that makes it all worthwhile.

And then the man continued, pointing to Ginger, who was at that moment lying on the floor of the hall licking his bollocks, “See that dug? When Scotland is independent that dug will be on a stamp.” And that is now my favourite personal reason for wanting Scottish independence, because after Scottish independence Ruth Davidson will have to lick my dog’s behind.

Irrespective of what our own personal reasons are for wanting independence, there’s one reason for independence that’s more important than all the others. It’s a reason that affects all of us, involves all of us. That reason is democracy. We currently live in a state which is not democratically accountable to the people of Scotland, and because the mistresses and masters of that state are not democratically accountable to the people of Scotland, they can lie to us, cheat us, and treat us with open contempt. They can do so without fear of any consequences, because they know that there is nothing we can do about it.

So we end up with every single promise that the Unionists made to Scotland during the referendum of 2014 being broken with impunity. 13 frigates built on the Clyde? Not happening. Jobs in the tax offices safe? Not happening. Scotland’s place in the European Union secured? Not happening. The permanence of the Scottish parliament and the Sewel Convention being given the force of law? A worthless piece of cant. Scotland a valued and equal member of a family of nations? Now you’re just taking the piss.

We live in a country which has been crapped on from above for so long and with such frequency that many of our compatriots think it’s normal. You turn on the TV news, you look in the newspaper and you see seven shades of shite and think it’s normal. We are habituated to crap. It *is* normal, in the UK. But just because something has happened so often that it’s considered normal doesn’t mean that it is desirable. The tragedy of Scotland is that we’ve been living amongst the jobbies for so long that too many in this country believe that mediocrity is the best we can aspire to. Even worse, they revel in Scotland’s mediocrity because it allows them to believe that the crumbs that we receive from Westminster’s table are a feast and not a famine. Meanwhile Scotland’s democracy starves to death.

This week there have been talks between Westminster and the Scottish government about the devolved Scottish powers that are currently exercised by Brussels. Westminster is proposing that after Brexit all these devolved Scottish powers will be taken over by Westminster, and then Westminster and Westminster alone will decide which if any will be returned to Holyrood. Only in the UK could the stripping bare of existing devolved powers be described as “giving extra power to Holyrood”. It’s a naked power grab by the Westminster government. Even the Labour First Minister of Wales, Carwyn Jones, called it that. He’s outraged. Scotland’s Labour leader? Not so much. Kezia only gets outraged by pro-independence bloggers. But it’s going to happen anyway. There’s not much Scotland can do about it.

Only independence can allow the people of Scotland to live in a country where our political masters can be held to account. Where we can vote them out of office if they displease us. Where they suffer the consequences of their lies and deceit. What happens right now is that we vote them out of office, and then they get a seat in the House of Lords and continue to make our laws and influence our public life anyway. Scotland voted twice to remain a part of the EU, but is being taken out anyway. Scotland voted for the powers of its partliament to be enshrined in law, but was lied to and there’s nothing we can do about it. That’s not democracy. The best reason for Scottish independence is because it is the radical notion that democracy in Scotland would be a good idea.


weegingerdug.scot

The Wee Ginger Dug has got a new domain name, thanks to Indy Poster Boy, Colin Dunn @Zarkwan. http://www.indyposterboy.scot/ You can now access this blog simply by typing www.weegingerdug.scot into the address bar of your browser, the old address continues to function, the new one redirects to the blog. The advantage of the new address is that it’s a lot easier to remember if you want to include a link to the blog in leaflets, posters, or simply to tell a friend about it. Many thanks to Colin.


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Many thanks.

50 comments on “Scottish democracy would be a good idea

  1. m boyd says:

    I think the naive assumption that we have all made over the years was that the UK played it straight and was a functioning democracy. As loyal subjects we bought the lie and we bought the lie that we were equal partners in the UK. We even bought the lie rightly or wrongly that one side in N Ireland was to blame for the troubles and although we could be heavy handed we believed it was ultimately justified. What is more and more apparent is that the British state sees us in much the same light as it does the Nationalists in Northern Ireland even where we seek our goal through peaceful democratic means. We are demonised and castigated and treated like second class citizens for the effrontery of seeking self determination. Democracy does not apply to us and even the pretence is failing.

    • It’s true – we HAVE, for far too long – believed that ultimately the Westminster Government meant well by us, even if their view of what was good for us didn’t coincide with our own. They do NOT mean well by us or by anyone other than themselves and their pals in big business, finance etc. There really IS no longer any pretence of democracy for Scotland until and unless we take our future back into our own hands.

      • m boyd says:

        Agreed, but we will be completely naive if we think that Westminster will role over and grant another referendum. They know it will be much closer this time and they will continue to state the SNP don’t have a mandate and the Scottish people don’t want it. What then? Does the SNP this time have a PLAN B? We need to call a UDI, plain and simple.

  2. […] Wee Ginger Dug Scottish democracy would be a good idea There are many reasons for Scottish independence. We each have our own individual […]

  3. Brian Powell says:

    We can give up on Labour politicians in Scotland, while Labour in Wales performs very poorly and Labour in England couldn’t win after 7 years of Tories and Brexit, Slab thinks it can save the UK if it stands in the way of change long enough and somehow we al start voting Labour, but most likely getting Tory governments.
    What I struggle with is the remaining Labour voters who go along with the idea, or rather lack of ideas.
    I guess many baby boomers are Labour voters and now they are the fearful, cringing remains of a people who did nothing but desperately hold on to anything they got so easily.
    Their parents fought WW2, their children died in Iraq, they had free education, all the financial security of building societies for reasonable housing, which they sold for a few hundred pounds each. Now their children can’t get affordable housing.
    They depend on and claim to defend the NHS but are not willing to take the action that will keep SNHS in public hands. The Naylor Report is going into action in England and will affect Scotland.
    They are the Labour legacy and their wretched hands pull away at the foundations of democracy in an Independent Scotland.

  4. Ruth, Willie, and Kezia, while I realise that you are all off on holiday sunning it or boozing it up in 24/7 Festival night clubs, I know that Roden’s or Gardham’s minions are reading this excellent blog.

    What part of ‘democracy’ don’t you understand?

    Are you still sticking to the Unionist line that even if 100% of Scots citizens voted for a second independence referendum, 100% voted Remain, and 100% voted for Self Determination that you would still demand that the will of the people be ignored because, well, just because.

    I ask and demand an answer. Is Scotland a ‘country’, like Sweden or Holland or England?
    I would find it hard to comprehend if any of you ‘democrats’ answered in the negative.
    So we are all agreed, Scotland is a country in its own right.

    We voted 62% to Remain in the EU, we voted for a Holyrood Administration mandated to hold Indyref 2 if there were a material change in circumstances or it was clearly the will of the Scottish people. Both boxes ticked. We voted in a Pro Independence Parliament, and you can’t get a bigger material change than being dragged out of Europe despite the clear democratic decision by your fellow country men and woman to stay in the EU.

    You are all still ‘Scottish’ aren’t you?

    While you are all away on your 9 week summer break clutching you £10,800 in publicly funded Travellers’ cheques, a ‘foreign’ emissary from the EVEL English Parliament met with representatives of your Scottish Government, you will be coming back in the autumn to ‘carp from the sidelines’ won’t you, and informed our democratically elected representatives that they were on plums as far as repatriated powers from the EU was concerned.

    The English Government was taking back control, and Mundell will sit on the pressure cooker Up Here while WM and Whitehall carve up the pie-xit among themselves.

    Or Ruth, Willie, and Kezia, do you consider that we are a colony of England’s fading Empire, a subjugated people, conquered in 1707 by our English suppressors, and there’s an end to it.

    If I hear one of you spout ‘Better Together’ or ‘£15 billion deficit’ or ’10 year waiting list at the back of the queue behind Turkey’ , I shall pee myself laughing as you confirm what I and millions of your fellow Scots already know, that you have sold out, for English gold, and give not a bum dangleberry for the welfare, wealth, and well being of your fellow Scots.

    Rant well and truly over.

    A magnificent piece, Paul.
    BTW I’d buy a ticket to attend while the Honorary Colonel licked WGD’s ass.

    • mboyd says:

      I remember a few years ago being on a flight from England to Spain when I overheard the English girl in front of me exclaim to her boyfriend: ” Scotland isn’t a country like Holland… my then English girlfriend stopped me from telling the idiot in front that Scotland was indeed a country while Holland is now a defunct historic state and today there is both a south and north Holland in Nederland but no “Holland “.

    • Jan Cowan says:

      No, Jack. She’s not fit to lick any part of that wonderful wee dog. Keep Ginger safe, Paul.

    • A masterpiece, Jack, on a par with Paul’s excellent blog. And I too would pay good money to watch Davidson’s tongue applied to WGD’s erse!

  5. Macart says:

    Great post Paul and hits the nail on the head. They won’t keep their pledges. Never intended to. Didn’t and do not see the need to.

    To the hardline Yoon, the true believer, it’s not even an issue. They really don’t care that those pledges were broken. They were a means to an end during a campaign and so far as they’re concerned? That’s okay, just peachy, a win’s a win etc. Hell, some of their number would happily see the abolition of the Holyrood parliament and the extinction of Scottish democracy and Scottish culture.

    They don’t give a shit that people were lied to, deceived and their trust betrayed. They couldn’t care less about loss of rights, catastrophically declining conditions for major demographics or the omnishambles that is Westminster government. They B E L I E V E.

    Leadership battles, Brexit, DWP run amok, graft, patronage, scandals, all of that is proper politics you know. It’s just that the provincials don’t understand this is how politics and government of empire is meant to be. Basically Game of Thrones without the LOLs.

    They have an identity and a world view you see and they’ll protect that identity regardless of cost. They’ll protect it through right or wrong and by fair means, though mainly foul. As for their ideological and constitutional opponents? Who cares how they are treated or what crimes are committed against their rights democratic or otherwise? The misery of… others, doesn’t really matter to them so much.

    THAT is the mindset of the establishment and those who support the establishment.

    Democracy matters. Your rights matter. Choice matters.

    You use them, or you lose them.

    • Dave Hansell says:

      Quite. At all levels, establishment as well as the servile arse licking, sycophantic, forelock tugging, cap doffing and mindless flag waving Uriah Heep’s who support that establishment which hold even their own followers in contempt, one sees the immature mind of a mardy five year old who has to be the biggest, badest and bestest otherwise their whole psyche will collapse into its own void.

      Still desperately and pathetically clinging to the rigid hierarchy of an idealised bygone age of empire where everyone was made to know their place. Such wretched creatures are not only a parasitic drag on social progress and democracy but also a growing threat to the survival of the human species. Not that they care, or have the capacity within them to comprehend that caring is in their own self interest. As long as they deludedly hold on to the illusion that they are chosen to be the last (white) man standing everything else, including the survival of life on the planet itself, can go to hell as far as these children who simply must have their own way are concerned.

  6. Jason Smoothpiece says:

    Well said sir.

    Sadly the BritScots don’t want to hear this sort of talk.

    They are not all stupid, many of those who are beginning to realise that independence is the answer can’t admit they have been so wrong.

    It takes a strong person to admit that their political and sometimes sectarian beliefs are very wrong.

    Some folk just can’t change despite the overwhelming evidence presented on sites like this or by enlightened friends.

    • Ealasaid says:

      Around 50% of the population is not some small fanatic faction. While they observe what is going on with the Brexit negotiations they must be taking all this in and starting to question the media. No wonder the media is trying to put out the message that the YES campaign is dwindling.

      It is up to us to demonstrate that YES is not shrinking but is actually growing. I feel the anger slowly rising. I don’t think it is going to be so happy clap next time.

      Another great post Paul!

  7. […] Source: Scottish democracy would be a good idea […]

  8. Patience is a Virtue says:

    I was going to reply to Annie Martin’s comments in ‘a substandard democracy’ in the previous WGD blog regarding the petition urging David Mundell to resign – but my internet connection crashed at the point of sending, (probably the fault of the SNP) but it fits just as well here….

    i feel this was a bit harsh on the Secretary State, not forgetting ‘Guardian of Sccotland’, as it failed to list some of his achievements:

    At a time when there were 56 SNP MPs, 1 Labour MP and 1 Liberal MP in Scotland (and of course 1 Conservative MP, David Mundell), David became ‘Secretary of State for Scotland.’

    This is a remarkable achievement, as in most democracies 56 is a much bigger number (than 1) and the Party with 56 MPs would ordinarily be considered ‘in the majority’, …. but this is Scotland where it matters not one jot if all 59 MPs had been from the SNP ..or indeed any other party, …. would someone from the SNP? (or any other Party) have been made Secretary of State for Scotland.

    To add insult to injury the Labour Party (remember also with only 1 seat in Scotland at the time) … a Shadow Secretary of State for Scotland was appointed – from the Labour Party, who was not even from a Scottish constituency.

    Our Secretary of State also voted for retention fo Trident, the voting went as follows:
    against the of Trident 56 SNP MPs, 1 Liberal MP and 1 Labour MP = 58 opposed to the retention of Trident;………… and for the retention of Trident = 1 (Conservative – David Mundell, the Secretary of State for Scotland.

    This being Scotland, Scotland gets to retain Trident.

    Scotland clearly does not want Trident…its elected representatives voted en masse against its retention…. except of course our Secretary of State (elected on an overwhelming mandate of …… one).

    The above illustartes the democratic deficit .within Scotland .. where the Country of Scotland votes a particular way and it matters not one jot (unless of course if the Labour Party or Conservative Party, whichever may be in power at the time, may be in agreement), then ‘Scotland’ does not get what it voted for.

    The above is only surpassed (in democrartic deficit) by the most remarkable display of unity across the polical specrum/divide with the Conservative, Labour, Liberal and SNP ranks broadly in agreement, campaigning on a similar theme / objective (in Scotland at least), resulting in the unique in modern times result of EVERY constituency area in Scotland voting to Remain in the EU. [there is much that is undoubtedly not right with the EU and needs amending… but this was the decided will of Scotland].

    Scotland does not want to Leave the EU. Scotland as Country voted to Remain in the EU .

    Yet in the current constitutional arrangements (as per the Treaty of Union), more a treaty of convenience, where there is effectivley a 10 majority at Westminster to the betterment of one side to the the long term detriment of the other- this is not a Union of ‘equals’, nor are we (certainly in Scotland… I am sure others may wish to comment) treated as equals under this arrangement or have equal or fair representation -indeed recently we have seen ‘English votes for English Laws ..imposed by the 10 to 1 majority (and of course the discretion/opinion of The Speaker.. ………..where exactly was this in the Treaty of Union?

    The EU vote in Scotland highlights the current issue (democratic deficit) but also Scotland’s future,

    whatever the vote may be all constituency areas in a Refendum or if all 59 MPS vote in favour / or against something (whatever is the topic of the day…… and Scotland does not, cannot get what it votes for.

    Whether you support the Union or are a supporter of Independence you, need to be aware of this…. and what the future holds for you under these arrangements.

    …as on past form – where is the evidence for instance, that Scotland is the most powerful devolved democracy in the world?, the most listened to? the most respected? equal partner in this Union?… when the Supreme Court rules that there is no requirement to even consult the devolveded Parliaments?

    Clearly the existing arrangements is not ‘democracy’ – certainly not what those o’ independent mind aspire to.

    Today’s National’s front cover has a picture of John Swinney and Michael Russell on one side of the table (presumably arguing Scotland’s case for the rightful/appropriate return of powers to the Scottish Parliament following the UK government’s determination to take us out of the EU),,, on the other side of the table is Damian Greem and David Mundell, the Secretary of State for Scotland..

    I am puzzled why the Secretary of State for Scotland is not on the same side of the table as his Scottish colleagues.

    • Excellent, Patience.
      There are still those who live and work here who stick by their guns: Mundell himself believes that Scotland ceased to exist in 1707 when a parcel of robber Barons, who at the time held the population of Scotland in serfdom and oppression, sold our country to their English equivalents.
      300 bloody years later, in this 21st Century, we are still expected to behave like underlings, to meekly accept that the Iron Heel Oligarchy still prevails because they control the money, manipulate power through hereditary hotly disputed ‘ownership’ of vast estates, maintain stewardship of key positions in Law, Higher Education, Finance, and the Military, positions of absolute power which are the exclusive right of the Few, handed down from generation to generation, through the ‘class system’, colonial managers who from birth are taught that they have a right and a duty to rule over and suppress the Hoi Polloi of the North Frontier.

      The time has come to dissolve this crooked Union.

      I refuse to allow an English Parliament to take away my right to be a citizen of Europe.

      Dugdale, Davidson, and Rennie have some serious soul searching to do before they crawl back from their sabbaticals.

      No more, Scotland.

      Rise up and resist the oppressor.

    • AnnieM says:

      Here’s the petition again in case anyone else wants to sign against this useless waste of space.

      https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/david-mundell-should-resign

      This is probably a stupid question, but does the SoS for Scotland have to be an MP from the governing party?

  9. JOHN MCCALL says:

    On the currency question, I propose we use first class stamps as both currency and stamps! The price of a first class stamp will always be precisely 1 stamp. Simples!

  10. Many, many thanks for this blog post, Paul. I howled with laughter at the beginning and with outrage towards the end. I really cannot understand why 100% of Scots aren’t raging against the broken promises of the 2014 campaign and the utter contempt with which Scotland has been treated by this and previous Westminster governments. What will it take to wake them up to reality?

  11. Macart says:

    Worth a listen.

    http://talkradio.co.uk/news/alex-salmond-says-scotland-should-hold-second-referendum-after-brexit-humiliation-17081017303

    and Worth a read.

    https://publiclawforeveryone.com/2017/08/10/a-blatant-power-grab-the-scottish-government-on-the-eu-withdrawal-bill/

    https://news.gov.scot/news/brexit-bill-talks

    Y’know, a lot of people visit this site and read these posts and threads. A great many were probably reluctant no voters last time round, or hopeful no voters, or indeed last chance no voters.

    From this week’s press offerings alone, there can be little doubt of the truth of Better Togetherness, government by Westminster (see links above) and information derived from mainstream media.

    It’s not a great truth to have to face I’ll admit, but it IS the truth nonetheless (see under Scotrail satisfaction rating retractions in multiple titles, Salmond doesn’t read books Times gaff, BBC/Skye/Police Scotland/Tourism farce). If it’s any consolation, they pulled the wool over a great many people’s eyes for a very long time.

    The next bit is up to you. You can help folk change this and all you need do is put a mark on a bit of paper and maybe talk to a few friends. Let them know what you now know.

    Help us put the power to change things back where it belongs. In our own hands, with a government we elect, to administer to our specific needs and aspirations. A government that is truly representative of its population, rather than one which manipulates the opinions of those in its care to achieve its own ends.

    Pretty certain the help would be appreciated.

    • Thanks for the links, Sam.
      On John Nicolson’s Talradio interview with Salmond, I posted:-
      “If May gets her three year ‘transitional phase’ post April 2019, during which the 3 million or so EU citizens providing vital work in our hospitals, universities, agriculture, tourism, finance, well, just about in every area of social and economic activity in this country, would be ‘allowed’ to work on, then I agree that Indyref 2 may be held within ‘2 to 3 years’, once the impact of Brexit hits and hurts.
      The 180,000 EU workers in Scotland will surely vote Yes this time, having been conned the last time into voting No by the Project Fear lies and threats that Scotland would be kicked out of the EU, and made to join, in Lord Darling’s words, ‘a ten year queue behind Turkey’ to get back in, if at all.
      I still favour April ’19, before Engwaland leave the EU, and attempt to drag us with them, in the certain knowledge that EU workers will be able to vote. Post April ’19, with no Transitional MOU in place, would they be allowed the vote in Indyref 2?
      I have my doubts that the EU27 (28 if we include us) will grant a ‘stay of execution’, since May and Co are determined to use EU workers, and alarmingly, Brit exiles working or retired in Europe, as ‘bargaining chips’, where the UK Government has no ‘bargaining’ leverage at all.
      Our thanks to the former FM for resurrecting ‘Bozo’: I shall use it.
      Good luck with his review.
      Great to hear John Nicolson’s mellifluous and dulcet tones on the airwaves again.
      Busted Flush and Pounce..I take it that they are one and the same, a wee Techie anorak in Roden’s Propaganda Bunker?

      On Professor Mark Elliott’s Legal Opinion on the ‘Claw Back Powers’ Bill’, Mike Russell, doing his Holyrood Day Job has issued a statement following his fruitless meeting with Green and Mundell, an abstract of which sums it up for me.
      “…the EU Withdrawal Bill. The bill as currently drafted is impractical and unworkable. It is a blatant power grab which would take existing competence over a wide range of devolved policy areas, including aspects of things like agriculture and fishing, away from Holyrood, giving them instead to Westminster and Whitehall.
      As we have made clear, we are not opposed in principle to UK-wide frameworks in certain areas — but this must be on the basis of agreement among equals, not imposed by Westminster.”
      Take note, Ruth, Kezia and Wullie, Russell is still hanging in there, trying to make Brexit work, but with the 62% wishes of Remain Scots being taken into account.
      Green and Mundell’s response, oh look, a red squirrel.
      Soon now, even the most fervent No-ers will realise that WM is determined on a ‘power grab’, and consequently our devolved Administration will be disregarded and subsequently sidelined. Where will it end? Dissolve Holyrood all together?
      Professor Elliott’s summary hits the Brexit nail on the head:-

      “But the UK Parliament’s legal sovereignty does not render it a monopolist when it comes to determining the acceptable rules of interaction between the several governments and legislatures that wield democratic power within a British constitution that is unrecognisable from that which existed when the UK joined the EU over 40 years ago. And in whatever other senses (positive or negative) leaving the EU may involve a turning back of the clock, it will not afford the UK Government the luxury of a 1970s-style British constitution in which power was hoarded in London. The referendum result may stand for the (questionable) notion of “taking back control”, but it leaves unanswered any detailed questions about where, post-Brexit, “control” over relevant matters should reside within the UK’s contemporary multi-layered constitution.”

      Yet Kezia and Ruth are ‘democrats’ who campaigned for Remain, but who now advocate what the Good Prof cautions against:- the 52% 48% does not render ‘the UK Parliament sovereign monopoly when it comes to determining the acceptable rules of interaction between the several governments and legislatures that wield democratic power within a British Constitution.”
      While the SNP are ‘getting on with the day job’, The QEU Hospital does not burn, and despite the Yoon Press lies, is not built of materials more combustible than a 11th July No Surrender bonfire.
      Come out come out, wherever Yoons are.

      • Macart says:

        The timing of any referendum will have to be before Brexit is finalised, but after the ‘deal’ and its probable consequences become known. It has to occur before irreparable damage is done to our new Scot’s citizenship, our economy, our democracy and our society. So, yes 2019 Sring to Autumn sounds about right given the known timescales of A50, but the unknown nature of events yet to occur.

        On the ‘power grab’? Well, it truly, TRULY, is a case of don’t say you weren’t warned about the nature of Westminster, the democratic deficit and devolution.

        It is WHO and WHAT they are.

        It can be put to rights though.

      • Andy Anderson says:

        I worry Jack that a few I come into contact with are actually still totally oblivious to all this. No hope for some. I wish they would wake up soon. I try to help but some just say no. Having said this a couple of unionist people I know are actually starting to question what is going in. I live in hope.

        • Andy, I think that it was Dr Johnson who quipped:- ‘A hanging concentrates the mind wonderfully.’

          Once Brexit bites, the price of everything rockets, visas are required to go on holiday to Europe, job opportunities for our kids on the Continent are nigh impossible, when May’s ‘bargaining chip’ ploy backfires on her and hundreds of thousands of essential personnel in our hospitals, hotels, and agriculture vote with their feet and move back to the EU zone, and our ‘ex pats’ are forced out of their retirement homes in Spain, France, Italy and Portugal by sheer pressure of finance on their devalued pensions, and the constant fear of falling ill and having to pay privately for treatment in their adopted home, then it will not be just the Scots 38% Leave who will be having second thoughts, but the rabid Leavers in the ‘North East’ of England who will witness Toyota gradually packing up and moving to Poland, will be demanding a Second Referendum, which of course they will denied.
          Right now, millions of English holidaymakers are undergoing a reality check on the Continent, where there has now reached parity ; £1 =1Euro.
          It was reported that airports were offering 88 eurocents per £1 recently.
          Banks and Finance houses are already triggering moves out of the UK and back into the EU.
          I predict a UK GE in the Autumn, which perhaps partly explains why May has disappeared for a month in darkest Europe.
          Money Talks, and English Money is screaming blue murder.
          May is toast.
          However, Indyref 2 is still our only option now, no matter how much of a mess that England has managed to get itself in.
          I think that you’ll find that a significant number of Scots born Noers will vote Yes this time.

          • Dave Hansell says:

            I can confirm the 88 Euro cents at airports. Just got my bank statement which includes a debit card purchase of two coffees, costing €3.50 each, at Munich airport whilst in transit to Moscow in mid July.

            The sterling cost was greater than the Euro cost with the exchange rate being exactly 88 Euro cents.

  12. markrussell20085017 says:

    Just terribly disappointed that Alex Salmond was cut-off in his prime this morning on the Today Programme just as he was about to recount an experience of a BDSM session. Any tickets left for his Fringe show tonight?

  13. Deelsdugs says:

    Great stuff Paul, though I would be hesitant at Roothie’s venomous slavers on the WGD’s bottom…

  14. Les Bremner says:

    The Draft Referendum Bill, Chapter 2.11, is specific in the inclusion of citizens of other EU countries resident in Scotland. http://www.gov.scot/Publications/2016/10/8279/4

    It states :
    “The following groups of people will therefore be entitled to vote in the referendum
    (if they are not subject to any legal incapacity to vote):
    – British citizens resident in Scotland
    – Commonwealth citizens resident in Scotland
    – citizens of the Republic of Ireland and other EU countries resident in Scotland
    – members of the House of Lords resident in Scotland
    – Service/Crown personnel serving in the UK or overseas in the Armed Forces or with Her Majesty’s Government who are registered to vote in Scotland.”

    • Les, my point being that if we wait until after April 2019 ‘ citizens of the Republic of Ireland and other EU countries resident in Scotland’ will no longer be legally resident in any part of the UK. Some are getting their marching orders now.
      As I observed before, my Everlovin’ is Irish: I’ll miss her terrible like.
      Will those who live and work here still be eligible to vote once the UK is officially out of the EU, i.e., April 2019?
      I know the Yoon answer to that. No way, Jose, Francois, Mario, and Helmut.
      Has there been a ruling on this?

      • Les Bremner says:

        Jack, as it happens the next section in the Bill states “With the passing of the Scottish Elections (Reduction of Voting Age) Act 2015, it is no longer necessary to make specific provision for 16 and 17 year-old voters as they are now included in the existing register of local government electors.

        It was a purely Scottish Decision in 2015 about eligibility to vote. It is up to the Scottish Parliament to determine whom they wish to vote in the Referendum. Whether or not the citizens in question are defined by Westminster as being aliens, we can define that, for the purposes of voting, they may do so as residents since they are physically here.

        That will test the mettle of Holyrood, since Scottish Bills require Royal Assent before becoming an Act. Her Maj. may not like the idea of losing her last colony.

        • Les, they slapped us down when we attempted to invoke Sewell, they slapped us down, on one side of an A4 from Davis to Mike Russell, rejecting out of hand the Scottish Government’s Proposals for alternative arrangements with EU 27 for Scotland, they slapped us down yesterday on devolved powers returning from Brussels to the Scottish Parliament.
          A pattern is developing. They have previous.
          We are a subjugated race, oppressed by our English neighbours.
          Anything that we propose through Holyrood that they don’t like, they slap us down.
          Of course we go ahead as planned, but watch Davidson Dugdale and Rennie shriek and declare that the Will of the Citizens of Scotland to remain in the EU as an Independent nation is invalid since the 500 odd English MPs vetoed Johnny Foreigners voting in the Referendum.
          They actually believe that we must ask England’s ‘permission’ for everything.
          Scots born Scotland deniers every one.

          • Les Bremner says:

            Then we proceed with a Referendum without Westminster’s permission, and without Royal Assent. The only benefit in having approval from outside Scotland is to tie London down to agree with the result.

            It has been clearly enshrined in law that Scotland operates under the sovereignty of the people, so therefore we consult the people.

            Fine, don’t call it a Referendum, call it a Plebiscite of the Scottish People. Run it totally under Scottish control, using Scottish funds. We built the Queensferry Crossing using that principle.

            Whatever we do, if the will of the Scottish people is for Independence, that is what the United Nations will recognise as our desire for self determination.

            We need to stop being subservient. This is a divorce and divorces can be very dirty. We need to attack, legally and forcefully.

            • Agreed, in spades, Les.
              I will not tolerate Ruth Davidson telling us what we can and cannot do. The ridiculous notion that any of us pay attention to her, or Dugdale, or (don’t laugh) Wullie Rennie, when it comes to making decisions about our future well being, and that of our children, and our children’s children,
              and the fallacy that English MP’s and/or a WM Government have some sort of power over us and can thwart the sovereign will of the citizens of Scotland, borders on arrogant exceptionalism of the first order.
              There is no going back to subservience.
              They had their chance post 2014. They lied and attempted to put us back in our box.
              The EU Referendum was the tipping point.
              I will fight with my last breath to regain independence.
              Let no foreign Government stand in our way now.

              • hettyforindy says:

                Noticed she, ie untRuth was again on front page of th National Friday, and it was not the usual case of having to find the paper, by going through every pile of yoon rags, and then finding a copy of the National on the bottom shelf, upside down. Someone round our way likes her. Looks like any publicity is better than no publicity for the yoons.

  15. I have just read The Sutherland Clearances by James Hunter The title is Set adrift upon the world. The story would make a brilliant film it looks at the clearances from all perspectives and is a book I could not put down.it brings the story up to date looking at the same class differences that still exist today. Patrick Sellers and the conflicts within society then and now make an absolutely must read to illuminate where power really lies in society and the trials and tribulations of those who spoke out. The battle with the women against the writs brings the events to life.only started reading wee ginger dog recently a real breath of fresh air .thank you and long may your lum reek.kind regards

    • Andy Anderson says:

      I agree a good book on our history. A totally different story from the 1700’s is ” A cairn of small stones”. Another time of cultural change.

  16. Annie Martin says:

    I agree with the opinion that EU citizens resident in Scotland would definitely vote yes in Indyref2, but my worry is how many of them will have moved back to their home countries before we have another referendum?

  17. Macart says:

    There’s no middle ground here. It’s either Holyrood or Westminster. Independence and self governance, or continued democratic deficit and the surrendering of your rights to those who simply couldn’t give a shit whether you exist or not and couldn’t find your home without the aid of a GPS and a six man safari.

    It’s the stewarding of your own resources and a government which you elect, or having others steward your resources through a government you don’t elect and who is ultimately not accountable to you.

    At this point in time PARTY POLITICS IS NOT AN OPTION. People need to realise that the SNP are a vehicle, an instrument, for change as well as a party of government. If it helps folk who normally place their vote elsewhere, don’t look at them as a party, but as a means to an end. You do not need to be an SNP member or supporter to recognise that right now, at this particular period in time, they are the best chance, the ONLY chance the people of Scotland have of being given a constitutional choice. A choice NO other party would EVER be willing to give our population and most certainly not the sainted Jeremy.

    If they lose their place or influence in any way shape or form over the next parliamentary term, then the real losers will be Scotland’s population and no one else. For we will have rejected the right and the opportunity to choose for ourselves.

    It’s often said that running your own country is for grown ups. I agree. It’s time for some folk to grow up now. If they want a system of government where their voice will be heard, with a written and codified constitution, a progressive, inclusive and outward reaching internationalist aspect, then it’s only going to happen one way.

    ALL of us together.

    The SNP are the key to a locked door. All folk need to agree upon is turning that key and stepping through the door. What folk do on the other side is the grown up bit.

    • Thank you, Sam, for expressing my own feelings so much better than I could have done it myself. I have always believed – and said – that traditional Party Politics needs to be shelved until Independence is achieved. Once that day arrives, then tribal allegiances can be resumed if people so wish. Until then – the SNP is the only political vehicle we have – “the key to a locked door” as you so succinctly say. How I wish we could enable more folk to see that!

      • Macart says:

        Appreciated Wendy. Kind of a waking up grumpy thing. If I see one more damn blog or ‘celeb’ article telling the SNP what they should do, or ‘how they’re doing it all wrong’…. some white goods and a few walls round my gaff will wind up getting seriously damaged.

        I don’t do party politics, but it really doesn’t require a degree in politics to work out the ‘bleedin’ obvious’.

        (Posted elsewhere): Mr Corbyn’s Labour, or indeed any other kind of Labour won’t make for a fairer, more progressive settlement for Scotland. Devolution, ANY kind of national devolution within the UK, is merely a means of controlling satellite legislatures. It certainly won’t progress independence for an absolute certainty.

        There are no mainstream parties with enough votes or seats out there, other than the SNP, who could or indeed would further self determination for Scotland’s population (that is not a dig at the Greens, merely the current political landscape). No other major party would even acknowledge or grant Scotland’s electorate the right to choose.

        NONE.

        To vote for Labour or the Libdems hoping that someday maybe never they’ll deliver a federal solution, which they could NEVER realistically guarantee delivery of, is merely voting for continuance of business and politics as usual. As for voting Tory? Oh, take a wild guess. They don’t even pretend to approve of devolution, never mind the federal carrot.

        The SNP don’t govern a Scotland that voted for independence near three years ago. They govern a Scotland that narrowly voted for continued devolution and yeah, that means participating in Westminster politics because that is what they were instructed to do by their own electorate. That means mitigating rather than legislating directly. That means getting slapped in the face repeatedly by their opposition and a hugely hostile media daily and it means being forced to stand by as their country and its electorate get dropped into an economic and constitutional clusterfuck by the biblical arrogance and idiocy of central government…

        …because that is what the majority instructed them to do. To abide by the devolved settlement and participate in UK politics. They are guided by a democratic mandate and hamstrung by the walls the electorate built around them, not walls they built themselves.

        Maybe worth a thought should the odd ballot come along. The walls we build, we can also take down. (ends)

        That’s the reality Wendy. The SNP live in the political environment our electorate mandated them to and abide by a political settlement and agreement we told them to abide by. Only by enough people wanting that to change will any change happen.

        We can choose a different path, but we have to want it as a majority.

        • Thanks again – I’ve copied this to my PC so that I can “read, study and inwardly digest” as the saying goes. It is inevitable that I will want to call on your words of wisdom when in “discussion” in other places!

        • Marconatrix says:

          “some white goods and a few walls round my gaff will wind up getting seriously damaged.”
          Maybe you should keep a pile of rotten fruit handy? Just please don’t kick the cat, OK? 😉

  18. William Davidson says:

    Scottish nationalists would appear to hold a very low, even patronising, opinion of the people of Northern Ireland, apparently “Brexit” is going to send us savages spiralling into a civil war. Well, we didn’t have a civil war between 1970 and 1998, the vast majority of us didn’t engage in violence, we got on with our normal lives, we had a “conflict” imposed on us by a small minority of terrorists from both communities, who have now stopped doing what they should never have started doing in the first place. So, if I were you I wouldn’t be scanning the south-western horizon for the glow of flames anytime soon. Sorry to disappoint.

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